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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:52 pm 
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MR T wrote:
GBC wrote:
Oh no Trevor, it's THE POLICE and THE AMBULANCE SERVICE the relatives representatives were talking about in the main news programmes tonight, not the fans who rushed in, or the blokes like Duckenfield who made the order.

Perhaps the relatives representatives and their expensive legal reps might phrase it better, but that wouldn't make headlines.

Bit like the hundreds of thousands who have been killed on our roads since hillsborough without any real headlines.

You obviously didn't see the mother of one14 year old child, speaking to the woman police officer who held him in her arms as he died....



I didn't, I saw what the other 60 million viewers were treated to by the relatives spokespersons, highly paid legal reps, and greasy politicians clambering over each other to blame THE Police and THE Ambulance service.

Shame the real truth and ALL the facts were not broadcast.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:56 pm 
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we always knew they lied.... now so do you..... and everyone else

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Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:02 am 
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THEY


Big word eh?

All encompassing.

Includes lots of people.

But let's concentrate on the emergency services.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:05 am 
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Was Heysel the authorities fault as well?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:06 am 
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GBC wrote:
THEY


Big word eh?

All encompassing.

Includes lots of people.

But let's concentrate on the emergency services.

They is the correct word.... at this time....

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:08 am 
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GBC wrote:
Was Heysel the authorities fault as well?

You tell me.... did the authorities lie as well

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:12 am 
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Here's one from a fan Trevor.

Sums it up nicely I think.

Removes your personal emotion and prejudiced views of authority:





Personally I think you are wrong if you put the "blame" solely down to Duckenfield, SYP and Sheffield City Council.

Taylor's report, like many others who have commented are afraid to apportion any sort of blame to certain groups, IMO. That is not the done thing to do.

I base my views on a few things. At that time I was a keen follower of Villa and yes Hillsborough was a death trap waiting to happen. But likewise so were many grounds of the time. I remember Highbury when we won the league was a crush to get in, being at Highfield Road when there was no escape from Villa fans pushing and trying to force their ways into the fans "pens" that we had to be led into like animals then. A lot of people make comments now that are not based on experiences of that time, but mostly of the sanitised and a lot safer grounds that we now have. The general feeling of Gvmt at that time were that all fans were animals that needed to be caged in with little regard to safety, comfort or any sort of concern. I moved to work in Sheffield the weekend of the disaster and in the weeks that followed stayed in hotels that were also used by Police force etc from many areas that were helping out afterwards. Some of the comments were very clear that they felt problems were caused by, bad policing, lack of organization from council, police but also from the FA and as importantly the attitude of some fans. The pubs around the ground were full of fans as you would expect and the previous times there had been trouble which resulted in some people gaining admission to the ground without tickets. It was seen as a bit of laugh, no one really thought anything as awful would occur. I have friends who were working in a couple of pubs used by some of the fans and they said it was like something out of the OK Coral at times.

Since the disaster there has been a concerted effort by some people to absolve themselves of any sort of blame. You may say that is the police, but I would also include the Gvmt of the time, the FA and also (and the one that certain groups never want to hear) the fans. When all start to realize this things will move forward once and for all.

It was a terrible disaster, not the fault of one man, one group or one instance. It was an awful cocktail of events that resulted in tragedy.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:19 am 
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There is a lot of truth in that...... But it says nothing about the deliberate manipulation of the press by the police.... and how it became the fans' fault that people died.... which we now know was a lie....

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:23 am 
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GBC wrote:
Here's one from a fan Trevor.

Sums it up nicely I think.

Removes your personal emotion and prejudiced views of authority:





Personally I think you are wrong if you put the "blame" solely down to Duckenfield, SYP and Sheffield City Council.

Taylor's report, like many others who have commented are afraid to apportion any sort of blame to certain groups, IMO. That is not the done thing to do.

I base my views on a few things. At that time I was a keen follower of Villa and yes Hillsborough was a death trap waiting to happen. But likewise so were many grounds of the time. I remember Highbury when we won the league was a crush to get in, being at Highfield Road when there was no escape from Villa fans pushing and trying to force their ways into the fans "pens" that we had to be led into like animals then. A lot of people make comments now that are not based on experiences of that time, but mostly of the sanitised and a lot safer grounds that we now have. The general feeling of Gvmt at that time were that all fans were animals that needed to be caged in with little regard to safety, comfort or any sort of concern. I moved to work in Sheffield the weekend of the disaster and in the weeks that followed stayed in hotels that were also used by Police force etc from many areas that were helping out afterwards. Some of the comments were very clear that they felt problems were caused by, bad policing, lack of organization from council, police but also from the FA and as importantly the attitude of some fans. The pubs around the ground were full of fans as you would expect and the previous times there had been trouble which resulted in some people gaining admission to the ground without tickets. It was seen as a bit of laugh, no one really thought anything as awful would occur. I have friends who were working in a couple of pubs used by some of the fans and they said it was like something out of the OK Coral at times.

Since the disaster there has been a concerted effort by some people to absolve themselves of any sort of blame. You may say that is the police, but I would also include the Gvmt of the time, the FA and also (and the one that certain groups never want to hear) the fans. When all start to realize this things will move forward once and for all.

It was a terrible disaster, not the fault of one man, one group or one instance. It was an awful cocktail of events that resulted in tragedy.

I wonder if he would have written that... knowing what we know today

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:25 am 
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You still can't see or accept the whole picture Trevor. That's up to you, I don't guess anyone's gonna loose much sleep over it.

But I'm glad there's fans like the above chap who wrote that post who can, and accepts everyone had an input into the deaths that day, not just 'THEY' because of some inbuilt prejudices they've carried around for 70 years.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:25 am 
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And I think you'll find that post is hot of the press.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:31 am 
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I am not a football supporter... only ever been to one-game.. never wanted to go again, but I support the familys.. especially the families of the children that died, their lives and their deaths were made out to be meaningless... and that was wrong....

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:37 am 
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Who we are
The Hillsborough Family Support Group was founded in May 1989 by a majority of the families who lost loved ones in the Football Disaster at Hillsborough Stadium Sheffield, England on the 15th April 1989. A few families met whilst traveling to and from the Lord Justice Taylor Inquiry, and decided that we should contact every next of kin and form a group. We held our first meeting at the Vernon Sangster Sports Centre, Liverpool. By July of the same year, we had democratically elected a committee and held our first committee meeting.

As our logo implies, the bereaved families came together to help and support each other throughout the aftermath. It became very clear at an early stage that a strong group was needed if a campaign to bring out the truth and ensure justice was to succeed. These pages will help you realise the amount of work the HFSG has done in their search for justice and how hard we had to fight against insurmountable odds. We are the original Hillsborough group and would like to thank Liverpool Football Club for all their support over the years.

Yours truly

Margaret Aspinall
Chair
Hillsborough Family Support Group

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:41 am 
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http://hillsborough.independent.gov.uk/ ... report.pdf

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 2:49 am 
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GBC wrote:
Yes I agree, not one fan that day done anything wrong, all angels, all sober, not a swear word between them, not one pushed into the game.


You forgot to mention that not a single one of them deserved to die ffs, they went to watch a football match. The fans may not have been angels etc etc but they didn't try to cover things up

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