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 Post subject: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:18 pm 
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After hour of research, speaking to experts and reading current code of conduct, I thought I would offer some guidance for drivers looking to purchasing a CCTV System.

Their is generally three types of systems you can purchase.

SD Card (camera type card)

Flash Card (larger Card less common)

Hard Drive (2.5inch Hard Drive the same as seen in Laptops)

To give you a guide of things to take into account and their terminologies.

H.264-MP4
Compression of the data, there are two types in the main, Mp4 (older) and H.264 (newer). The newer H.264 will compress the data (picture and sound) by half again. Meaning you will get "about" double the recording time for the same size of storage.

Frames Per second (FPS)
European standard TV signal is 25fps. (meaning 25fps will give the smoothest picture)

Reducing the FPS will give the film a flicker book appearance, to the point were it would be a series of time laps photographs.

Cameras

There is generally three types for Vehicles known as

380 TV Lines
420 TV Lines
520 TV Lines

Again these are different resolutions.
420 is capable of IDing

Lens angles
These come in many forms but as a guide for a Vehicle 1/3 3.6mm lens is spot on.
Warning!
One has to be very careful when purchasing the "all in one" systems, as many are fitted with a "fish eye" lens. These are designed to ID the driver NOT the rear view passengers. The lens makes the back seat so small that in many conditions this would not be possible.

IR (night Vision)

Night Vision Cameras come with different filming distances in their design, so make sure that the camera offers around 2-5 metres, any more and the picture will be a white glare. Any less and the rear passengers will be in darkness.

**Please note, proper colour cameras switch to Black and White when filming in low light levels**.


Resolutions

Most modern CCTV systems allow you to select a resolution.
examples are

CIF 320x320 low resolution, not for IDING people

Half D1 or CIF2 720 X 260 which is capable of IDing people

Full D1 720 X 520 this is High Definition.

Reducing the resolution will result in extended recording times but could make IDing people more difficult.
Half D1/CF2 is a happy medium.



Rough guide to storage times.

A 2 Camera system (filming at average resolution and 25fps) with Audio on a 32 GB card (Max on many systems) will give you around 30hr recording time. Conversely a 250 GB HD will give 234 Hr

Date, Time , Car Registration Stamp

Any system has to have, Time, date and Car registration stamped on the film.
In order to seek conviction this is a must!! The car registration is also a must for insurance purposes.

Storage Types

SD and Flash cards now have tens of thousands of write times, so reliability is no longer an issue. However storage size to price is extremely expensive compared to traditional Hard dives. (this will fall in the coming years)

Although SD and Flash Card memory sizes are increasing, existing systems will not read these. So upgrade path is very limited.

Hard Drive systems can normally take anything from 80GB to 2TB (most the max is 500GB)

Hard dive failing or overheating.

All modern Vehicle DVR use 2.5 Hard Dives as opposed to the 3.5 Hard drives used in older and standard PC's. This is for two reasons.
2.5 HD are designed for laptops which means they have much higher temperature tolerances, secondly they are designed to withstand shocks.

If purchasing a Hard Drive unit make sure it has a "good" make of Hard drive. All main stream manufacturers offer anywhere from 3 to even 10 year warranties 24/7 use.

SSD, Solid State Drives

These are the future and will eventually replace mechanical Hard Drives altogether(a good 5 to 10 years away). The GOOD NEWS is, any 2.5 Hard Drive system can be upgraded to a Solid State Hard Drive, as opposed to SD Card systems that can only read the Card size they have been designed for (usually 32Gb).

So an ideal system is....

2 x Camera, recording inside and outside front (for Insurance purposes)
1/3 2.6mm 420 TV Lens, Night vision IR 3/5 Metres Max

Date, time, reg number stamp.

Set to record 25Fps at medium resolution Half D1

Storage minimum 120GB which will give roughly 112Hr

Talking to CCTV suppliers and Insurance companies many incidents that require evidence to resolve don't come to light for several days after the event. I think 112Hr is a happy medium between cost and efficiency.

Hope this helps anyone walking the minefield of CCTV. Welcome anything I may of missed or question feel free to add/ask. :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:29 pm 
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So a 32 GB card will, if used with audio and two cameras, give you just over a day's worth of recording.

Can bigger cards be used and how much more are they?

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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 7:22 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
So a 32 GB card will, if used with audio and two cameras, give you just over a day's worth of recording.

Can bigger cards be used and how much more are they?


What I didn't mention is there are differing SD formats, some cheaper than others....so please check

As a general rule very few systems take cards greater than 32GB, so no you can't...... a rough cost for a decent card is £33(not ebay, many forgery's) IF your system could take a 64GB it would cost you a staggering £135.

Put that £135 into perspective, you can get a 120GB Solid State Drive for under £100 now.


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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:08 pm 
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How would you upgrade a hard drive to the new super dupa hard drives, and what sort of price?

And will that increase the storage?

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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:29 pm 
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I think that I should point out that the system you envisage, is for a saloon car (PH) and would be useless in a Hack, as any customers in the rearward facing seats would not be covered.

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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:32 pm 
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wee eddie wrote:
I think that I should point out that the system you envisage, is for a saloon car (PH) and would be useless in a Hack, as any customers in the rearward facing seats would not be covered.

Could we not have a 'condition of passage' that each punter has to at least once look and smile at the camera? :wink:

I suppose the front facing camera could be situated at the rear of the cab rather than on the front of the rear-view mirror.

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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:33 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
How would you upgrade a hard drive to the new super dupa hard drives, and what sort of price?

And will that increase the storage?


The prices over the last year have fallen substantially but are still to expensive (for large drives). Mechanical drives are starting to fall in price again, they doubled over night due to the flooding in Thailand.

Give you an idea..... Mechanical 500GB £60....... Supa dupa 500Gb hard drive £550 :shock:

Which is why I said 5 to 10 years!!!

Replacement is simple, remove the Hard Drive caddy. On the sides will be four screws that secure the drive in place. The Drive has a connection on a ribbon cable that plugs into the drive.
Once changed over, go into the software for the unit and format the drive....all done.

The point is a Hard Drive system can be upgraded, for example you bought a larger cab and wanted to add more cameras. You simple add a larger Hard Drive. However if you purchased a SD system your stuck with at most 64GB more usually 32GB.


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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:35 pm 
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taxeman wrote:
However if you purchased a SD system your stuck with at most 64GB more usually 32GB.

And with that you get a few days worth of storage. :?

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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:43 pm 
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wee eddie wrote:
I think that I should point out that the system you envisage, is for a saloon car (PH) and would be useless in a Hack, as any customers in the rearward facing seats would not be covered.



Sorry your correct it would be a salon vehicle.

However in order in use in a WAV you simple add another camera, which is the advantage of a Hard drive system. If you add a third or four camera, in order to retain your recording times you simply install a larger Hard Drive. =D>

I have never come across a Hard Drive DVR that does less than 4 Video Channels (cameras) There are plenty of SD systems that only have two.


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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 11:56 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
taxeman wrote:
However if you purchased a SD system your stuck with at most 64GB more usually 32GB.

And with that you get a few days worth of storage. :?


Yep and no upgrade path


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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 7:47 am 
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I know I shouldn't ask this.....

But what are the rules in respect of sticking CCTV on the front windscreen? :?

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 Post subject: Re: CCTV System Facts
PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:45 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
I know I shouldn't ask this.....

But what are the rules in respect of sticking CCTV on the front windscreen? :?


Now that is a can of Worms, I suggest that drivers remember that ALL liability should an accident be in anyway attributed to a windscreen mounted system is theirs....even if a Tester stupidly passed it.

I would also check for a very tell tale sign, if the unit was removed by the tester it meant the unit made the vehicle unroadworthy!!


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