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PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2020 6:03 pm 
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bloodnock wrote:
"Spaces for people Programme"....geeze they do like a trendy catchphrase when in reality people have survived just fine for over a hundred years with the space they already had, have'nt these supposedly cash strapped councils anything better to do with their (your) money than b*gger about widening pavements on narrow roads just to appease a few radical protesters that put idealogy before practicality.

So, they get a wider pavement and it makes not a jot of difference, money that could have been spent more creatively and productively to really help their community and it's economy has been squandered by councillors who have nothing better to do...the Signs on the street say it clearly.."To Let, To let"...their towns economy needs help not hindered.

Bang on =D>

Better not say what I really think about all this though :-#

Edders wrote:
It looks as if your council is like ours take a decision finalise it and then do a token public consultation to make it look as if they consulted first!

Bang on as well =D>

And, again, better not say what I really think 8-[

But in this case I don't think the consultation was even 'token' - there really just wasn't any kind of consultation at all as far as I can make out [-(


Anyway, looks as if the outcry means at least *some* of the barriers are to be removed, but whether that will include the rank, I'm not sure [-o<

Controversial changes to St Andrews town centre to be removed after outcry

https://www.fifetoday.co.uk/business/co ... ry-2996816

Fife Council has been forced to reverse changes made to St Andrews town centre this week, following an outcry from local businesses and residents.


But look at the likes of this nonsense. No doubt the pavement beside this butcher's shop in Crail isn't particularly wide. But, I mean? And I wonder where the buses are stopping?

Suspect butcher gets a lot of local residents and the likes of farmers driving up, and he'll lose a lot of that business. Instead they'll got to the likes of the Co-op supermarket in Anstruther, where there's a typical supermarket car park with plenty of space.

Or even to the bigger Morrison's store in St Andrews, which is on the Anstruther/Crail side of the town, and right on the edge, so people don't even have to go into St Andrews =;

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And, of course, if all this isn't binned now, doubt if any of it would be moved until spring next year at the earliest.

And a lot of it is obviously just pedestrianisation by stealth, so suspect a lot of it would just remain, and permanent barriers put up instead.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2020 8:57 pm 
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Well it's all going swimmingly :-s

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2020 9:11 pm 
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:28 am 
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To be fair, at least if people think there's not enough space on the pavement, now they can step off, and risk tripping over one of those yellow things, or falling over one of the barriers, or slipping on those dodgy looking cobbles, or walking into a tree =D> :roll:

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Meanwhile, some of the barriers have been moved from where the rank was, and it seems to be the food delivery lads using it while they're picking up from the takeaway opposite :roll:

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Later a pished up couple came along, and the girl started kicking the barriers, and ended up lying partly on the road, but luckily the only passing taxi had just gone by. You can just see her head near the ground, and the dark shadow beside her is the guy trying to pull her up :roll:

So just the usual fun and games, but different toys, and at 10pm rather than 2am =D> :roll:

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:34 pm 
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According to a piece in the Courier, cyclists have been using the barriered area as a cycle lane, which someone is claiming is unsafe. Certainly has a point, but they're usually on the pavement anyway, so it's swings and roundabouts :roll:

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And a business rep saying the barriers were strewn across Church Street and Bell Street (the rank street) this morning, causing havoc.

The rep says: "We don't know what's happened during the night..." :roll: #-o :lol:

No prizes for guessing, surely... =D>

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Anyway, looks like most of the stuff will have gone by Monday morning, but what's the betting they leave the rank closed off because the pavement is a bit narrower there? :cry:

But I suppose if the whole street ends up with TO LET signs then people won't want to walk down it anyway.

Job done =D>


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2020 8:51 pm 
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Who's doing the work...Lego?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2020 3:00 pm 
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Blood wrote:
Who's doing the work...Lego?

Well, it's certainly a sledgehammer to crack a nut, just like some people's use of the quote function :roll:

But I've 'arranged' to have your post cut down to size, so it says the same in five words than it did having to scroll through almost three screen widths :-s

Quite funny, though - I might use the lego gag at some point in the future =D>


Anyway, just when I thought there was some light at the end of the tunnel, things have only gotten worse ](*,)

So several days after they blocked off the rank, they've now installed the temporary rank in the other street. Which is bad enough, for the reasons I outlined a few days ago :roll:

Not only that, but drivers are still using the loading area half way down the street where the old rank was, so there's now two different 'ranks' within spitting distance of each other.

So this shows the cars in the loading bay, with the new 'rank' just beyond the zebra crossing and the crossroads at the top of the street:

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In the photo below you can see the yellow sign right on the corner, which is the sign they use when the rank is relocated there for three nights during the annual Lammas Fair, and even the sign is slightly amusing. It says:

TAXI RANK
Reserved for Taxis only


Yes, some people really don't know that a 'taxi rank' is 'reserved for taxis only' #-o


Anyway, there's three cars ranking here, and the one on the right is obviously just waiting there to join the queue. But because of the one-way system, anyone getting into one of these cars will be paying an extra 70p or so, in fact a maximum of 80p, at least for most of the runs from this area.

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Normally we're allocated half that street during the Lammas Fair, and there's another 'TAXI RANK - reserved for Taxis only' sign at the front of the rank =D>

But I couldn't see any sign, so not sure if there isn't one, or if it's maybe been moved by someone.

But photo below shows a white private car parked in front of the taxis, which is why there's only room for three cabs. Whether the white car would be there if there was another 'TAXI RANK - reserved for Taxis only' sign further up the street is anyone's guess. There's effectively zero enforcement of that kind of thing at the best of times, never mind at this time.

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The only saving grace is that there's less than half the cars out than there would be normally, so it could be a lot worse :sad:

But with the pubs and restaurants shut now I only went out later on in the vain hope that they'd have put the rank back to normal, only to find that it's even worse - I'd prefer the way things were working mid-week with the loading bay and a feeder system to what's happening now :roll:

Anyway, I drove around a bit, and sat for a while on the rank on the other side of the town centre, but nothing moving at all really, so just gave up and went home without even one fare :cry:

Office cars still moving around a bit, but for those of us dependent on the street work, nothing's moving at all :sad:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 5:40 pm 
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Well it seems that people in the village of Crail have taken things into their own hands. This article isn't really about the trade, but can you imagine what would happen if taxi drivers tried to do something like this? Who knows, it might work. But I suspect it would more likely mean police action, a criminal charge, and an appareance before the licensing committee. Maybe even immediate suspension of badge.


Angry Fife villagers take matters into own hands amid call to scrap ‘ludicrous’ parking barriers

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/lo ... -barriers/

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Image: James Glen/DC Thomson

Angry business owners in Crail have removed controversial barriers installed to give more pedestrian space and aid physical distancing during the coronavirus crisis.

Disgruntled shop owners have resorted to draining water from the large barrier blocks and dragging them aside to allow parking outside their premises in Crail after they were installed as part of the Spaces For People initiative.

Fife Council has already bowed to pressure and removed similar barriers in place in St Andrews after a public backlash and now many in Crail are demanding the same.

The local authority has been accused of being undemocratic by fitting the barriers without consultation with either the shop owners or residents.

Fife Council received £2.4million from the Scottish Government for its Spaces for People fund designed to make walking and cycling safer in towns and villages deemed fit by the council, during the coronavirus crisis.

However, it has already removed barriers in St Andrews after more than 1,000 signed a petition calling for the scheme to be scrapped.

Crail butcher Keith Penman said shopkeepers had been given no say in matter.

He said: “We had a leaflet outlining what the scheme was, but nothing more.

“Barriers have been removed as many of the elderly or disabled residents need to park close to the shop.

“The whole thing is a bit of a shambles.”

The barrier scheme has also been branded “ludicrous” by Crail Community Council, chairman David Jerdan.

“The barriers make the roads look like a cross between a war zone and a Grand Prix circuit and do more harm than good,” he said.

“I’ve been contacted by many elderly and disabled people who now go elsewhere because they have been excluded from parking at their local shop.”

Independent councillor Linda Holt, said the instillation of the barriers had been undemocratic and businesses were already struggling to survive.

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Image: James Glen/DC Thomson

She said: “It’s not surprising that people are moving the barriers themselves when they are doing the opposite of what they are supposed to do – making streets safer for people.

“Communities like Crail know what is needed to look after their residents and this, rather than a paper exercise by Fife Council, should be the starting point for any interventions.”

She said a strong response to the petition would underline the strength of feeling when the North East Fife area committee meets on October 28.

Labour Councillor Altany Craik, transportation and economy spokesman, said: “Officers have visited assess what changes can be made to best make this work.

“It has been difficult previously because of the ongoing coronavirus situation to liaise with shop keepers and community representative but a greater deal of consultation will be taking place going forward.”


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 5:40 pm 
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Quote:
Labour Councillor Altany Craik, transportation and economy spokesman, said: “Officers have visited assess what changes can be made to best make this work.

“It has been difficult previously because of the ongoing coronavirus situation to liaise with shop keepers and community representative but a greater deal of consultation will be taking place going forward.”

But the council communicates stuff to the trade generally, and sometimes specifically about taxi ranks, using Facebook, emails and the odd letter.

And if they think it's difficult speaking to shopkeepers etc because of Covid, then presumably they wouldn't manage to be a taxi driver.

Anyway, finally got a response from the council to my email, which predictably sidesteps/ignores all the points I made. Will maybe post it later when I can take time out of my busy schedule :-s


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 7:15 pm 
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Fife Council wrote:
Thank you for raising your concerns regarding the Spaces for People temporary measures for St Andrews relocation of the taxi rank.

:-|

Quote:
Fife Council has now implemented the Spaces for People temporary measures in St Andrews, aimed at creating extra pedestrian space in areas where there is high footfall. the Council recognises the need to support commercial activity, but it is also clear that the community is very concerned about public health and the need to provide areas where people, particularly the vulnerable, can undertake essential journeys and adhere to the government's 'physical distancing' requirements. During the summer and at other times throughout the year it is locally acknowledge by all that St Andrews can be very busy and the footways very crowded. Our staff routinely saw that physical distancing on many of St Andrews streets, was not only not being observed, but was actually impossible, due to the narrow footway widths for the associated high footfall. A temporary change in favour of extra space for pedestrians was consequently required.

Don't know where to start with this.

I mean, how are the various risks assesssed :?:

If it's the summer tourists etc that's the main concern, why weren't the measures implemented until almost winter :?:

What 'essential' shops and businesses are located on the rank side of the street :?:

The rank itself is mainly premises To Let, and the rest of the street is the likes of an estate agent, 'styling studio', off-licence and posh clothes shops etc. And they aren't even open during the rank's evening operation.

The pavement on the other side of the street is quite wide, and there's zebra crossings provided at either end of the street.

As for the wider risks etc, could write several thousand words, so won't bother [-(

Quote:
To provide the information to the taxi operators of the changes proposed for St Andrews we were advised to post the information on the Taxi Facebook page, as there is no Taxi Association for St Andrew. Normal protocols used for consultation, such as public walk in consultation events or meeting in groups are not available to council officers due to Covid-19 restrictions.

Er, there's not been a peep about this on the licensing Facebook page. Only thing in recent weeks about local issues was back in August when counicl complaining to the trade about people complaining to the council about overranking on the other central rank. Now made worse in the evenings because of the Bell Street closure.

https://www.facebook.com/FCLicensingNews

Quote:
The new layouts have temporarily suspended the taxi rank in Bell Street as there was more space required for pedestrian movement. The new location in Greyfrairs Garden is as close as possible to the shopping area as can be accommodated and this temporary taxi rank site has been used previously as you state in your email.

Near to the 'shopping area' :?:

Er, it's an evening and nightime rank, so it's more about the nighttime economy than the shops :-s

And I hope that's not meant to address the points I made about the shortcomings about the replacement rank, which have been totally ignored :-#

Quote:
I trust you appreciated the new road layouts are a temporary measure and will be monitored and adjust where required.

:-|


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:12 pm 
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Breaking news!!

Someone has moved most of the barriers from the far end of the street, so the rank is working more like usual tonight, just a bit further back than normal, but with the pain of taxis sitting a short distance away on the temporary rank.

Don't know who moved the barriers, but it was private cars and vans parked there earlier on, so could be shops and businesses down at that end of the street, because all the vehicles have disappeared now as the evening has wore on :sad:

I even got out of the car to take a photo :-o

Can't see it lasting, though :sad:

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:21 pm 
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I suspect the traders moved them, and should the council re barrier, then I suspect they will be removed again.

See this is the problem when you give civil servants a bucket of cash, they have to spend it and spend it quick.

Hence the balls up we see throughout the UK.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:28 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
I suspect the traders moved them, and should the council re barrier, then I suspect they will be removed again.

See this is the problem when you give civil servants a bucket of cash, they have to spend it and spend it quick.

Hence the balls up we see throughout the UK.



Think our useless Council according to reports have to return £6 million, but not 1 penny of assistance forthcoming to the trade.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 11:41 pm 
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Whats happening to you Up there is happening all over Scotland in a myriad of different ways....down here it's Blanket 20 MPH zones in every Town and Village in the Scottish Borders.

The Common denominator appears to be the "Spaces for People programme which is funded by the Scottish Government and managed by Sustrans Scotland."

Now Sustrans is a UK walking and cycling charity and custodian of the National Cycle Network who work closely with the Scottish Government but who are not actually a part of the Scottish Government, they are pretty much an Environmental group passing themselves off as a charity, they have purely their own agenda at heart..they are using Mission creep, a wee bit here and a wee bit there until before you know it you'll be hamstrung and can't move.

Taking your rank away is environmentally and politically motivated and really does not create Spaces for People, hell the People that got these so called people spaces don't even want them and nor did many of them ask for them

They are also mostly behind the 91 Blanket 20 MPH zones within the Scottish borders...........how can they Argue that a reduction in a speed limit creates more space for people verges on the ridiculous and again the people were never consulted but they forced it on them regardless.

In appear to be driven by a car hating green agenda backed by a car hating SNP led Scottish parliament.

They are in danger of costing us tens of thousands of Scottish Jobs just to get their way of ensuring your right to drive a car becomes so difficult that they hope you'll buy a Bike or a pair of walking boots instead...it's little more than a legal version of Eco warriorism.

We Drivers fund all our roads regardless of what VED pretends its not, it is still the good old fashioned Road Fund License, yet such groups seek to Steal our roads away from the very drivers who pay for their contruction and maintainance and then give the use of them to those who dont...Bikes and Walkers.

Sustrans is out curb the freedoms of the Driving Majority just to appease the Cycling minority....many of those same Cyclists are also Drivers so they needn't think they'll be spared as they won't be.

This lot won't be happy until there is not a single Car left on Scotlands road.....Be prepared for a fight for your livelyhoods very, very soon, the Government listens to the Sutran Charity group and freely gives them your money to advance their agenda yet totally ignore you the tax payer who pays for it all...rotten huh.

I fear this may be part of an SNP sop to the Scottish greens as reward for them backing the SNP who do not have a majority in their own right at Holyrood

Time to wake up and smell the coffee before it's to late.

Welcome back to the Scottish Stone age 2020.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 11:49 pm 
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StuartW wrote:
Breaking news!!

Someone has moved most of the barriers from the far end of the street, so the rank is working more like usual tonight, just a bit further back than normal, but with the pain of taxis sitting a short distance away on the temporary rank.

Don't know who moved the barriers, but it was private cars and vans parked there earlier on, so could be shops and businesses down at that end of the street, because all the vehicles have disappeared now as the evening has wore on :sad:

I even got out of the car to take a photo :-o

Can't see it lasting, though :sad:

Image


Those barriers are more a environmental statement than a practical solution..indeed they are totally pointless.


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