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WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
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Author:  Brummie Cabbie [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:39 am ]
Post subject:  WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
The Department for Transport’s website shows the following latest statistics for the total numbers of wheelchair accessible licensed vehicles in England and Wales as at 31st March 2011;

Total WAV Taxis; 45,567 [58.4% of total taxis]
Total Taxis; 78,002

Total WAV PHVs; 3,795 [2.4% of total PHVs]
Total PHVs; 155,087

Bearing in mind that most wheelchair users phone and pre-book their licensed vehicles and pre-booked hirings is the business that PH drivers, vehicles and operators are in, isn’t it about time the LC looked very closely at this obvious lack of transportation services for the wheelchair user?

Source; Taxi Statistics (http://www.dft.gov.uk/statistics/series/taxis/)
Author:  captain cab [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
I'd say they have looked into it.

They are aware of the equality act and private hire being specifically excluded.

I'd also say they were very aware of what they've already said about national standards, how can they possibly set a national standard for PH....then suggest fleets of a certain size (for example) must have a quota of wheelchair vehicles available?

I'd follow this by pointing out, the law commission are very aware that PH covers a multitude of differing business operations, and will soon include wedding car and funeral businesses.

In short, unless the LC suggested something fresh, like perhaps a 3 or 4 tier system, to include taxis, private hire minicabs, private hire executive hire, and perhaps novelty vehicles, it wouldnt be possible. - now this sort of sounds like Mr Buttons idea.
Author:  MR T [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
I'm waiting for them to include wheelchairs.... if you push one yourself you'd be OK... but if you are being pushed by someone who was being paid.... should it be licensed
Author:  toots [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 2:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
The Department for Transport’s website shows the following latest statistics for the total numbers of wheelchair accessible licensed vehicles in England and Wales as at 31st March 2011;

Total WAV Taxis; 45,567 [58.4% of total taxis]
Total Taxis; 78,002

Total WAV PHVs; 3,795 [2.4% of total PHVs]
Total PHVs; 155,087

Bearing in mind that most wheelchair users phone and pre-book their licensed vehicles and pre-booked hirings is the business that PH drivers, vehicles and operators are in, isn’t it about time the LC looked very closely at this obvious lack of transportation services for the wheelchair user?

Source; Taxi Statistics (http://www.dft.gov.uk/statistics/series/taxis/)


Perhaps from a ph operator point of view they 'employ' the vehicles they need which in effect would show that there is an over abundance of WAVs within the taxi trade. The one thing we are unable to ascertain is the actual number (or near as damn it) of people that are wheelchair bound in the country and of that number what % are reliant on taxis or ph for that matter. One has to wonder of the 58.4% taxis that are WAVs what % of their work does actually require a WAV? Just a thought
Author:  Brummie Cabbie [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
toots wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
Bearing in mind that most wheelchair users phone and pre-book . . .

The one thing we are unable to ascertain is the actual number (or near as damn it) of people that are wheelchair bound in the country . . .

FFS Ms Toots.

And you're an ex-NVQ Assessor?
Author:  Brummie Cabbie [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
toots wrote:
One has to wonder of the 58.4% taxis that are WAVs what % of their work does actually require a WAV? Just a thought

In the last 25 months my percentage of wheelchair user passengers is 0.00%.
Author:  Sussex [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 5:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
Total WAV Taxis; 45,567 [58.4% of total taxis]
Total Taxis; 78,002

Total WAV PHVs; 3,795 [2.4% of total PHVs]
Total PHVs; 155,087

I think if the LC's plans come into fruition without change, then we could see the number of WAVs plummet.
Author:  toots [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
toots wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
Bearing in mind that most wheelchair users phone and pre-book . . .

The one thing we are unable to ascertain is the actual number (or near as damn it) of people that are wheelchair bound in the country . . .

FFS Ms Toots.

And you're an ex-NVQ Assessor?


I am able to assess NVQ candidates but I don't because I don't believe they are much good. With regards to my pc slip it was the only way I could think of to describe users that have to remain in the chair as opposed to those users that can get out of them for travelling purposes, apart from that nobody is perfect not even me :wink:
Author:  toots [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
Sussex wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
Total WAV Taxis; 45,567 [58.4% of total taxis]
Total Taxis; 78,002

Total WAV PHVs; 3,795 [2.4% of total PHVs]
Total PHVs; 155,087

I think if the LC's plans come into fruition without change, then we could see the number of WAVs plummet.


Why? They still plan to allow councils to decide what vehicles they allow for taxis, they are just not allowed to do so for ph :?
Author:  Sussex [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
toots wrote:
Why? They still plan to allow councils to decide what vehicles they allow for taxis, they are just not allowed to do so for ph :?

Currently 1000s of taxis are WAVs because the council issued them a license on that condition.

Any new act will say councils can dictate standards, but those standards will apply equally to all.

So councils will in effect have a choice, 100% WAV, or 100% saloon. Can't see many owners in mixed fleets lobbying for a 100% WAV fleet.
Author:  bloodnock [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
toots wrote:
One has to wonder of the 58.4% taxis that are WAVs what % of their work does actually require a WAV? Just a thought

In the last 25 months my percentage of wheelchair user passengers is 0.00%.


Ive had several wheelchair users, none of them needed or wanted a vehicle where they would remain in their chair to travel, and from my observations those few that do travel in their chair always seem to travel cut price courtesy of the volunteer brigade who can always seem to be able to afford new or nearly new WAV VW transporters with fancy electronic lifts.

Seems unfair that operators are expected to supply similar high cost vehicles out of their own pockets and not from a charity fund like the volunteers.
Author:  toots [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
Sussex wrote:
toots wrote:
Why? They still plan to allow councils to decide what vehicles they allow for taxis, they are just not allowed to do so for ph :?

Currently 1000s of taxis are WAVs because the council issued them a license on that condition.

Any new act will say councils can dictate standards, but those standards will apply equally to all.

So councils will in effect have a choice, 100% WAV, or 100% saloon. Can't see many owners in mixed fleets lobbying for a 100% WAV fleet.


So it's the one thing we know for sure is that the LC is not going to opt for mixed fleets?
Author:  Dusty Bin [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
Sussex wrote:
Any new act will say councils can dictate standards, but those standards will apply equally to all.


How do you come to that conclusion?

Quote:
So councils will in effect have a choice, 100% WAV, or 100% saloon. Can't see many owners in mixed fleets lobbying for a 100% WAV fleet


Even assuming you are correct I'd bet on councils going the other way.

And where does the Equality Act come into all of this - it endorsed mixed fleets?
Author:  Sussex [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
toots wrote:
So it's the one thing we know for sure is that the LC is not going to opt for mixed fleets?

Can't see how they can, but I will ask them when we meet.
Author:  Sussex [ Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WAVs; Something the Law Commission should look into
Dusty Bin wrote:
How do you come to that conclusion?

Can't see any other conclusion, unless they write into law powers to allow councils to discriminate.
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