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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 11:20 am 
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Nothing particularly new here, but a good summary of the current state of play, and of the GMB's case against Uber et al.

Stop wasting time and give workers their rights says GMB Union

https://www.taxi-point.co.uk/single-pos ... -GMB-Union

Uber drivers in the UK have scored a hat-trick in the legal fight to be treated as workers by the multi-billion pound ride-sharing company as the Court of Appeal in London rejected Uber’s appeal against two previous court rulings that their drivers work for them and are not self-employed, contractors or ‘business partners’.

Not satisfied with being told they’re in the wrong for a third time, Uber now intends to take their lost cause to the Supreme Court.

Worker status for drivers is something Uber has fought tooth and nail to avoid granting in order to save money through denying drivers basic rights to holiday pay, a guaranteed minimum wage and an entitlement to breaks.

GMB organises and represents private hire drivers across the UK who deserve a level playing field, which means being paid a decent wage and making sure passengers are safe - it doesn't mean working excessive hours or allowing exploitation to continue unchecked.

In 2016 we took successful legal action when our Uber driver members told us of the long hours they were working to make up for being paid far below the legal minimum wage, once the costs of doing the job were taken into account. With no right to paid breaks and holiday pay these drivers are completely dependent on the hours in the car. Add the ability for Uber to fix the cut of the money drivers make from their labour and it’s clear that far from running their own businesses, they are being taken for a ride.

When the evidence had been heard, the conclusions of the employment tribunal, as it ruled in GMB’s favour could not have been clearer: “The notion that Uber in London is a mosaic of 30,000 small businesses linked by a common ‘platform’ is to our minds faintly ridiculous”. Its judgment surmised the firm's argument that drivers are "self-employed" as based on "fictions, twisted language and even brand new terminology".

Instead of accepting the ruling and changing its ways, Uber showed itself to be unapologetic and set about challenging the verdict. Their arguments heard at the Employment Appeal Tribunal the following year. Another defeat did not dissuade it from seeking to flog its dead horse a third time.

The lengths this multinational, multi-billion dollar transport company has gone to avoid abiding by the ruling of the courts have become embarrassing. From the masquerade of claiming to be a ‘technology company’ to the waste of money on PR and legal fees fighting now three court rulings in the workers’ favour - it’s time for Uber to set an example to other ‘gig’ employers by giving up the game and facing up to its responsibilities.

Our landmark case against Uber shifted the landscape in favour of workers who are being exploited in the so-called ‘gig economy’, but this isn’t a fight against a new technology or industry. Our union was founded over 100 years ago by workers fighting against the scourge of long hours and casualisation of work that entrepreneur capitalists, as today, use to put profits for shareholders and investors over the workers who make them. If any employer in the so-called ‘gig economy’ thinks new technology will hide this same old-style exploitation they can think again.

That’s why Uber is just one example in our legal campaign against employers who refuse to play by the rules, including other private hire firms like Addison Lee, as well as online retail couriers such as DPD and DX.

So, in case Uber HQ has not made a New Year’s resolution yet, here’s one from us: stop wasting time and money on lawyers bills in the courts while refusing to engage with GMB and our members. Workers have fought for a hundred years to be entitled to these basic rights, and we’ll fight for a hundred more to keep them.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:28 pm 
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Caught a little bit of Bloomberg Tv while on holiday (financial Chanel) and it quoted a source saying that other competitors are nothing to be worried about and the fact that poober and deliveroo etc have never made a profit.bloody worry me!


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 9:58 pm 
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Quote:
Caught a little bit of Bloomberg Tv while on holiday (financial Chanel) and it quoted a source saying that other competitors are nothing to be worried about and the fact that poober and deliveroo etc have never made a profit.bloody worry me!

The vast majority of the business press have absolutely no idea of the full inns and outs of Uber. They merely follow the PR machine.

Uber will never make money, as to do that they have to up their prices, which will lead punters to go elsewhere, or up their commission from drivers, which will lead drivers to go elsewhere.

However the business press still look only at the crazy valuations, which does beg the question as to how many of them have vested investments in Uber, and are desperate for the flotation this year.

Which is currently being delayed by Trump's shutdown. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 3:37 pm 
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Couldn't agree more 'Sussex ',and their drivers r like the rats in the pied piper of Hamlin being led to the river!


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 6:41 pm 
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Sussex, you say :

''Uber will never make money, as to do that they have to up their prices, which will lead punters to go elsewhere, or up their commission from drivers, which will lead drivers to go elsewhere''.

I cannot see how uber can lose money...their system works by taking commission from every driver for every job done....25-30%...and their operations are automated...they have no staff answering calls ...so their costs are minimal...the major cost is advertising and promotions they initially use to entice users....so in London say....they have 20,000 drivers...each driver gross take is £100...so that means uber get £500,000 daily...add all other Uk locations where they operate and it amounts to a lot of money...

Maybe you know different ?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 7:23 pm 
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Maybe you know different ?

All you have mentioned is how Uber have been operating for many years, and for those many years they have been losing billions.

In short, and economists with much much more business savvy than me confirm, Uber lose money on every job by subsidising those jobs. At some time that subsidy has to stop, and that's when they will lose punters and drivers.

Even those who suggest Uber are working to a 'driver-less' future to make their money are also wrong, because the big car manufacturers will take over that path to riches, should it actually ever happen in our lifetime.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:35 pm 
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Yes, I accept uber are subsidizing their fares to a point...i.e. a new rider is given a £10 credit and their friends/cpntacts are given the same £10 freebie...bu that lasts a short while and then the riders start paying for services used.
Even the £10 subsidy is actually £7.50 since uber get £2.50 back in commission from the driver....
start up businesses lose money as they expand and in case of uber it is expanding across the world....and they are spending a lot in legal fees...promotions...and the rest...so in my view it is a profitable business as I cannot see where they could actually lose money.

As for ''driver-less'' cars...I cannot see them working for a long time if ever....


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 9:17 pm 
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The subsidising of fares is ongoing, not just through initial offers.

Their 2018 Q3 numbers boil down to revenue of $2.95 billion, however they made a loss of just under $1 billion. So that's a lot of discounting, subsidising, and promotions.

If tomorrow Uber stopped all the discounting and subsidising they would lose a significant amount of drivers and punters.

However to realise the value the numpty financiers have put on Uber they have to carry on discounting and subsiding to show growth.

It really is, IMO, a house of cards that will fall.

Link with the 2018 Q3 numbers. https://www.cnbc.com/2018/11/14/uber-ea ... orted.html

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