I didn't think I would ever utter these words in relation to that council.
But I will, well done.
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| PH signage for Edinburgh http://www.taxi-driver.co.uk/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10970 |
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| Author: | Sussex [ Fri Mar 13, 2009 8:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | PH signage for Edinburgh |
Crackdown on bogus minicab hire drivers after sex attack ALL private hire cabs in Edinburgh are to be fitted with new signs telling the public they cannot be hailed in the street, in a bid to crack down on bogus drivers. The move to tighten up the rules on minicabs comes a month after a teenage girl was allegedly raped by a man masquerading as a minicab driver. The incident was the most recent in a small number of attacks, which have now led city licensing chiefs to introduce the new rules. All private hire cars will now be required to carry branding, informing passengers the vehicles must be privately booked and not flagged down in the street. Drivers will also be required to keep log books to prevent the practice of "seagulling" where they begin touting for business by cruising the streets. Councillor Colin Keir, convener of the council's regulatory committee, said: "Over the thousands of journeys in the last year there have been four sexual assaults. "We have a very safe set of fleets, both taxis and private hire cars, but we're not standing still and safety is our main concern. "There will be a large sign on the back door of the vehicle which will say that it must be privately booked. "This is something we have been discussing for quite some time. Private hire cars are not allowed to ply for trade in the streets – they are not taxis." Raymond Davidson, secretary of the Edinburgh Taxi Association, said members of the trade backed the move. He said: "It has been decided that private hire cars must have signs on both sides of the vehicle. I'm in favour of that – I think that is definitely one area of the trade that needs tightened up. "Some passengers are not fussed about what kind of vehicle they get in and are just concerned with getting from A to B. "This move will make sure they know they are getting into a proper licensed car." Last year, a 26-year-old woman suffered a serious sexual assault after being picked up in the city centre by a bogus private hire car driver. It later emerged that the suspect, who had been living in Leith, had fled to Sudan. Police are continuing their efforts to trace him. |
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| Author: | bloodnock [ Fri Mar 13, 2009 8:47 pm ] |
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Quote: ALL private hire cabs in Edinburgh are to be fitted with new signs telling the public they cannot be hailed in the street, in a bid to crack down on bogus drivers .'
And that'll stop them Clambering in them....? If they clamber in a vehicle with no markings at all is it likely that they'll not clamber into a vehicle that says its not to be hailed....it won't make one Jot of Difference. |
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| Author: | captain cab [ Fri Mar 13, 2009 9:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PH signage for Edinburgh |
Sussex wrote: Crackdown on bogus minicab hire drivers after sex attack
ALL private hire cabs in Edinburgh are to be fitted with new signs telling the public they cannot be hailed in the street, in a bid to crack down on bogus drivers. Obviously the council and the trade have done a good job so far then......ffs all taxis are WAV's ! CC |
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| Author: | Sussex [ Fri Mar 13, 2009 10:30 pm ] |
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I didn't think I would ever utter these words in relation to that council. But I will, well done.
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| Author: | Council insider [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 12:52 am ] |
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Drivers will also be required to keep log books to prevent the practice of "seagulling" where they begin touting for business by cruising the streets. This is the most important part of the statement. If the log book idea is enforced then this may put a stop to PH picking up in the street. |
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| Author: | Stationtone [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 2:03 am ] |
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I have still not made up my mind whether this is a good thing or not. Will this mean that if anyone gets into these ph without pre- booking will be committing an offence ie By allowing themselves to being transported in an uninsured vehicle. |
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| Author: | gusmac [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 2:15 am ] |
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stationtone wrote: I have still not made up my mind whether this is a good thing or not. Will this mean that if anyone gets into these ph without pre- booking will be committing an offence ie By allowing themselves to being transported in an uninsured vehicle. The 1982 act says: Quote: Offences
21(1) If any person - (a) operates, or permits the operation of, a taxi within an area in respect of which its operation requires to be but is not licensed or the driver requires to be but is not licensed; or (b) picks up passengers in, or permits passengers to be picked up by, a private hire car within an area in respect of which its operation requires to be but is not licensed or the driver requires to be but is not licensed, that person shall be guilty of an offence and liable, on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding £2,500. Is a passenger not a person? |
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| Author: | chipper [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 4:09 am ] |
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Council insider wrote: Drivers will also be required to keep log books to prevent the practice of "seagulling" where they begin touting for business by cruising the streets.
This is the most important part of the statement. If the log book idea is enforced then this may put a stop to PH picking up in the street. PH have to keep a log book right now and hold on 2 it for 6months if i rem right. what happens right now is every job that a driver gets through the computer system is logged and if the cab office or police ask for proof that the job was booked you just pop down your HQ and get them to print it off. I rem about 2 years ago a mate was accused of seagulling by a off duty taxi driver and he complained to the cab office all myt mate done was get a print out of the job details from the office and the cab office were happy that all was above board. the only way you can stop attacks is better enforcement by the police at the peak times on a friday and saturday. the "pre booked only" sticker idea has been getting pushed by the PH for well over a year so for CEC to try to make out they have come up with a great new idea is a joke. i rem about 3years ago The PH company i worked for asked for the cars call sighns to be out on the windows just like it is with the hacks here the council said no you were not allowed sticker on your car that could sugest you were a taxi 
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| Author: | Sussex [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:58 am ] |
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Council insider wrote: Drivers will also be required to keep log books to prevent the practice of "seagulling" where they begin touting for business by cruising the streets.
This is the most important part of the statement. If the log book idea is enforced then this may put a stop to PH picking up in the street. But isn't that what the Scots Executive are announcing soon? And what's likely to be next? Taxi drivers doing likewise? 
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| Author: | bloodnock [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 10:57 am ] |
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Sussex wrote: Council insider wrote: Drivers will also be required to keep log books to prevent the practice of "seagulling" where they begin touting for business by cruising the streets. This is the most important part of the statement. If the log book idea is enforced then this may put a stop to PH picking up in the street. But isn't that what the Scots Executive are announcing soon? And what's likely to be next? Taxi drivers doing likewise? All my bookings are entered in my Bookings diary, Im guessing thats as good a Log book as you can get, what more would they like....teeth????? Its just another way to spy on us all by stealth.. |
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| Author: | Boring [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 11:45 am ] |
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gusmac wrote: stationtone wrote: I have still not made up my mind whether this is a good thing or not. Will this mean that if anyone gets into these ph without pre- booking will be committing an offence ie By allowing themselves to being transported in an uninsured vehicle. The 1982 act says: Quote: Offences 21(1) If any person - (a) operates, or permits the operation of, a taxi within an area in respect of which its operation requires to be but is not licensed or the driver requires to be but is not licensed; or (b) picks up passengers in, or permits passengers to be picked up by, a private hire car within an area in respect of which its operation requires to be but is not licensed or the driver requires to be but is not licensed, that person shall be guilty of an offence and liable, on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding £2,500. Is a passenger not a person? Relevant section is, of course, 21(1)(b), as 21(1)(a) applies to taxis, which are statutorily defined as hackneys with the right to ply the streets for hire. The proscribed behaviour in terms of 21(1)(b) is therefore a person who picks up passengers, or permits passengers to be picked up by an unlicensed vehicle. Clearly the passenger is not the person that the offence is directed at, as they do not pick up or permit another to pick up passengers. Rather, they are the object of the picking up, or permitting to be picked up, by the unlicensed private hire car or driver. The offence can therefore be committed by a driver, owner or indeed perhaps even a radio controller other other member of the PH Company, as the company would be expected to have procedures in place to guard against the commission of such offences. |
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| Author: | gusmac [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 2:35 pm ] |
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Boring wrote: gusmac wrote: stationtone wrote: I have still not made up my mind whether this is a good thing or not. Will this mean that if anyone gets into these ph without pre- booking will be committing an offence ie By allowing themselves to being transported in an uninsured vehicle. The 1982 act says: Quote: Offences 21(1) If any person - (a) operates, or permits the operation of, a taxi within an area in respect of which its operation requires to be but is not licensed or the driver requires to be but is not licensed; or (b) picks up passengers in, or permits passengers to be picked up by, a private hire car within an area in respect of which its operation requires to be but is not licensed or the driver requires to be but is not licensed, that person shall be guilty of an offence and liable, on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding £2,500. Is a passenger not a person? Relevant section is, of course, 21(1)(b), as 21(1)(a) applies to taxis, which are statutorily defined as hackneys with the right to ply the streets for hire. The proscribed behaviour in terms of 21(1)(b) is therefore a person who picks up passengers, or permits passengers to be picked up by an unlicensed vehicle. Clearly the passenger is not the person that the offence is directed at, as they do not pick up or permit another to pick up passengers. Rather, they are the object of the picking up, or permitting to be picked up, by the unlicensed private hire car or driver. The offence can therefore be committed by a driver, owner or indeed perhaps even a radio controller other other member of the PH Company, as the company would be expected to have procedures in place to guard against the commission of such offences. Reference to section 23(1) defines a taxi as: Quote: Interpretation of sections 10 to 22
23(1) In sections 10 to 22 of this Act:- “taxi” means a hire car which is engaged, by arrangements made in a public place between the person to be conveyed in it (or a person acting on his behalf) and its driver for a journey beginning there and then; and “private hire car” means a hire car other than a taxi within the meaning of this subsection. So any PH, out of area hack or any other unlicenced vehicle picking up unbooked fares is in fact a "taxi" without the relevant licence. The applicable section is therefore 21(1)(a) 21(1)(b) would cover picking up booked hires without a licence. Under 21(1), "any person" means exactly that, and is not just confined to the driver. This would include a passenger who permits themselves or anyone else to be picked up in such an unlicensed vehicle. That said, I have never heard of a passenger ever being prosecuted. |
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| Author: | JD [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 3:17 pm ] |
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Boring wrote: Relevant section is, of course, 21(1)(b), as 21(1)(a) applies to taxis, which are statutorily defined as hackneys with the right to ply the streets for hire.
Before someone with a less tolerant disposition points out your two glaring mistakes I should inform you that the statutory description in Scotland for a vehicle that ply's for public hire is "TAXI". Don't confuse Scottish Taxi legislation with hackney carriage legislation that applies to other parts of the United Kingdom. Your second and most alarming mistake is your failure to understand the provisions in section 21 subsection 1 (A) Section 21 relates to the offence of vehicles, drivers and others operating in a licensed area, where none are licensed to do so, or at least where one of the combination is not licensed to do so. I doubt it will have escaped many on this forum that in your haste you failed to grasp the most elementary basic fact “that Taxis can only ply for hire within the area for which they are licensed.” Section 21 is a provision that sets out the offence of both “taxis and private hire vehicles” and their drivers and other persons, who contravene operating license conditions in an area where they are "unlicensed." Therefore as the section states, any taxi that operates in an area where it is unlicensed commits an offence. Subject to the provisions set out in subsection 2 and 3 of section 21. I shall leave you to fend off the inevitable broadside you are bound to receive from the more vociferous subscribers to TDO. On a lighter note, I would just like to say that I sincerely hope my simple clarification of the 1982 act has made you a little wiser. Regards JD |
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| Author: | ALI T [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:39 pm ] |
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give him a break jd 
he deserves some credit for all that cutting and pasting. the great edinburgh hope................not.
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| Author: | JD [ Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:09 pm ] |
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ALI T wrote: give him a break jd
he deserves some credit for all that cutting and pasting. the great edinburgh hope................not. Well if your assumption is right about cutting and pasting I suggest he changes his source of information. On a more serious note if anyone thinks they can come on TDO and spout bullchit and expect to get away with it or substitute fact for fiction, then they are sadly mistaken. We have had enough idiots of that calibre in the past to last us a lifetime. Regards JD |
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