Good old Terry.
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| Author: | Brummie Cabbie [ Sun Jul 18, 2010 10:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | How private hire firms tie drivers into self-employment deal |
How private hire firms tie drivers into self-employment deals July 15, 2010 If you call a cab firm it's nigh-on certain that the driver who picks you up will be self-employed. London-based Lancaster Private Hire has lucrative contracts with a string of big firms, including the BBC. Most of its drivers are eastern Europeans who were told they could earn £400 or more a week in take-home pay. However, we've heard that the reality for some is very different. Alin Condrutz, from Romania, worked for Lancaster for two months last year and averaged £99 a week, after deductions for car hire, insurance and a security "bond". Lancaster said their more experienced drivers were better paid and happy. But should they really be called self-employed? Lancaster provides their accomodation when they arrive in the UK, their vehicles and insurance, and all their work. The GMB's national organiser for professional drivers, Terry Flanagan, says: "The private hire industry is rife with bogus self-employment, particularly among the larger companies." Source; http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigation ... e-dri.html |
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| Author: | captain cab [ Sun Jul 18, 2010 10:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Good old Terry.
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| Author: | Sussex [ Sun Jul 18, 2010 10:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: How private hire firms tie drivers into self-employment |
Brummie Cabbie wrote: But should they really be called self-employed?
Of course they shouldn't. It's a scam, and a not very clever one at that. 
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| Author: | christopherwk [ Sun Jul 18, 2010 11:43 pm ] |
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Just a fairly obvious way for the employer not to pay N.I, holiday, sick, pension... To be self-employed in this industry (private hire), I think you should have your own car, be able to work for who you want (more than one firm at a time), when you want, and also refuse jobs. However, this is difficult, since not many firms are going to hire you if you not available for a set period of time, and if you start cherry picking jobs, they're not going to be interested. |
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| Author: | wannabeeahack [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 9:00 am ] |
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"jockeys" have always been self-employed, when i did it 20 years ago it was 1/3rd for me, 1/3rd for the car and 1/3rd for the owner i remember 1 night i ended up with £10.... 
the I****d R****e have a test for self employment Employed or self-employed? In order to answer this question it is necessary to determine whether the person works under a contract of service (employees) or under a contract for services (self-employed, independent contractor). For tax and NICs purposes, there is no statutory definition of a contract of service or of a contract for services. What the parties call their relationship, or what they consider it to be, is not conclusive. It is the reality of the relationship that matters. In order to determine the nature of a contract, it is necessary to apply common law principles. The courts have, over the years, laid down some factors and tests that are relevant, which is included in the overview below. As a general guide as to whether a worker is an employee or self-employed; if the answer is 'Yes' to all of the following questions, then the worker is probably an employee: Do they have to do the work themselves? Can someone tell them at any time what to do, where to carry out the work or when and how to do it? Can they work a set amount of hours? Can someone move them from task to task? Are they paid by the hour, week, or month? Can they get overtime pay or bonus payment? If the answer is 'Yes' to all of the following questions, it will usually mean that the worker is self-employed: Can they hire someone to do the work or engage helpers at their own expense? Do they risk their own money? Do they provide the main items of equipment they need to do their job, not just the small tools that many employees provide for themselves? Do they agree to do a job for a fixed price regardless of how long the job may take? Can they decide what work to do, how and when to do the work and where to provide the services? Do they regularly work for a number of different people? Do they have to correct unsatisfactory work in their own time and at their own expense? |
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| Author: | grandad [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 10:01 am ] |
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Reading the above, I would guess that the get out is the payment. They are not paid by the hour, week or month and they don't get overtime pay and I doubt that they get bonuses. |
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| Author: | Bart [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 10:15 am ] |
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Sussex wrote: Brummie Cabbie wrote: But should they really be called self-employed? Of course they shouldn't. It's a scam, and a not very clever one at that. PH firms do not pay the drivers, the drivers pay them so how can the drivers be considered anything other than self employed? |
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| Author: | wannabeeahack [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 10:50 am ] |
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Bart wrote: Sussex wrote: Brummie Cabbie wrote: But should they really be called self-employed? Of course they shouldn't. It's a scam, and a not very clever one at that. PH firms do not pay the drivers, the drivers pay them so how can the drivers be considered anything other than self employed? i knew one courier firm who had drivers in ad-hoc and paid em using "i realise i am responsible for my own tax and NI contributions"......... then HMRC hit him with a bill for £115K and he had to sell the firm to pay the debt you cant be SE and only have 1 customer, which most jockeys have, driving for 1 car owner |
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| Author: | Sussex [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 5:21 pm ] |
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Bart wrote: Sussex wrote: Brummie Cabbie wrote: But should they really be called self-employed? Of course they shouldn't. It's a scam, and a not very clever one at that. PH firms do not pay the drivers, the drivers pay them so how can the drivers be considered anything other than self employed? Because the laws say so. |
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| Author: | edders23 [ Tue Jul 20, 2010 12:29 pm ] |
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Normally if you rent the car you are self employed but split purse deals can be deemed to be employment if the incompetent revenue service can be bothered to challenge a company round here quite a few companies have percentage drivers but the money in is declared in the books as car rent |
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| Author: | grzybov [ Thu Jul 22, 2010 12:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: How private hire firms tie drivers into self-employment |
Brummie Cabbie wrote: How private hire firms tie drivers into self-employment deals
July 15, 2010 If you call a cab firm it's nigh-on certain that the driver who picks you up will be self-employed. London-based Lancaster Private Hire has lucrative contracts with a string of big firms, including the BBC. Most of its drivers are eastern Europeans who were told they could earn £400 or more a week in take-home pay. However, we've heard that the reality for some is very different. Alin Condrutz, from Romania, worked for Lancaster for two months last year and averaged £99 a week, after deductions for car hire, insurance and a security "bond". Lancaster said their more experienced drivers were better paid and happy. But should they really be called self-employed? Lancaster provides their accomodation when they arrive in the UK, their vehicles and insurance, and all their work. The GMB's national organiser for professional drivers, Terry Flanagan, says: "The private hire industry is rife with bogus self-employment, particularly among the larger companies." Source; http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigation ... e-dri.html I hear that Addison lee in london is the largest employer of self employed cab drivers and they are boasting earnings in excess of 800 a week. is this true ? and does anybody know how this is acheived? i.e what do they earn on the fare and what do they have to pay in monthly rental etc. |
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| Author: | skippy41 [ Thu Jul 22, 2010 1:12 pm ] |
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Its all to do with who pays the fuel, as it says on the revenue site its that loophole that's taxi and PH owners are using to exploit drivers driving that company vehicles http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/paye/employees/s ... status.htm http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/employment-status/index.htm |
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| Author: | Sussex [ Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: How private hire firms tie drivers into self-employment |
grzybov wrote: I hear that Addison lee in london is the largest employer of self employed cab drivers and they are boasting earnings in excess of 800 a week. is this true ? and does anybody know how this is acheived? i.e what do they earn on the fare and what do they have to pay in monthly rental etc.
AL are the biggest licensed PH operator in London, but I personally doubt anyone on there takes home £800. 
Other than the bosses that is. |
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| Author: | GBC [ Sat Jul 24, 2010 4:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: How private hire firms tie drivers into self-employment |
grzybov wrote: I hear that Addison lee in london is the largest employer of self employed cab drivers and they are boasting earnings in excess of 800 a week. is this true ?
For a week? Wouldn't get out of bed at the weekend for that. 
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| Author: | christopherwk [ Sat Jul 24, 2010 9:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: How private hire firms tie drivers into self-employment |
What they earn, and what they take home are two different figures. I just did a quick quote on their website, £67.50 from Heathrow to W1. Do that 12 times a week (although unlikely), that will earn them just over £800, but their take home after the normal associated costs of renting and running one of their new Ford Galaxys, I doubt is £800 a week! |
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