Taxi Driver Online

Taxi association calls for a cap on number of licences
Dundee Taxi Association is calling for the city council to take a leaf out of Perth's book and place a cap on the number of taxi operator licences it hands out.

After carrying out a consultation on deregulating the trade in the area, Perth and Kinross licensing committee last week decided not to lift the cap on numbers which has been in place since 1979.

The issue has been something of a thorn in the side of taxi drivers in Dundee, who have been battling the council for several years to have the number of licence holders in the city regulated.

DTA secretary Tony Waters said there are already too many cabs competing for business in Dundee.

"It is unbelievable that Dundee has got an open policy and is still handing out licences," he went on. "We have been complaining about this for years, given the fact that other towns like Perth still have limits.

"It just doesn't make sense that Dundee still has this policy. We basically just can't figure out why they are continuing to hand out licences."

Mr Waters said he understood there are around 576 "hackneys" and a further 200 private hire vehicles on the road in Dundee, with numbers rising every month.

"Pie is only so big"

"Even if they capped the numbers now it would take years for the trade to recover," he went on.

"The pie is only so big and the Dundee population is dwindling."

As well as being hit in the pocket, the number of cabs on the road is raising safety concerns for drivers, he continued.

"The police have spoken to drivers about sitting in unofficial taxi ranks," he said. "But when the ranks are full, there is just no place to sit."

Dundee's licensing convener Rod Wallace could provide little short-term comfort to the taxi association.

He said the council was awaiting direction from the Scottish Government on the issue and it appeared unlikely that any information would be forthcoming before the Holyrood elections in May.


http://www.thecourier.co.uk/News/Dundee ... ences.html

Mr Wallace cannot make his mind up below is a email that was sent out to trade reps only hours after news article.

Dear

As you know, the Licensing Committee instructed officers to prepare a report on the options open to it with regard to the possible re-introduction of a limit on the number of taxis in Dundee. It was hoped that this would be available in September 2010, but it was made clear by the Committee at the time it commissioned the report that this was not a hard and fast deadline. As things have transpired, a number of issues have been thrown up in the compilation of the report, not the least of which is the Council's statutory duty to carry out equality impact assessments in connection with the various options open to it. I understand that there have been extensive discussions with the Council's Equalities Co-ordinator on this and that this process is almost complete. To that end, I would expect that the draft report will be ready for consultation by the end of February. It would be my intention to let all members of the Taxi Liaison Group have sight of a copy before it goes before the full Committee, at which time they will have the right to apply to be heard as deputations. There are no plans at this stage for a special meeting of the Group in advance of the Committee meeting at which the report will be considered.



As to the recent decision taken by Perth & Kinross Council on retaining a limit, that is entirely a matter for them. As I am sure you will be aware, there are many councils who have a limit and many who do not. It is for each Council to make its own judgment on this matter and this is what we shall endeavour to do in the forthcoming report.

And, what do you expect to achieve with this?

Those who should be leaving a hard pressed trade will be encouraged to remain in it.

The work will continue to be spread more thinly than market forces would dictate.

You guys are seriously stupid.

So, it's about crafting yourself some vested interest, some plate value. And your drivers will continue to pay hiked rentals.

And when things do pick up, the survey of demand required before the taxi trade can respond to any increase will allow the less regulated private hire to expand first.

You're gonna end up ;like Glasgow where the ration taxi to PH is 1:2.5 or greater.

Taxis still difficlut to hail at peak time, vulnerable females can't hail a taxi, they are encouraged into predatory unlicensed vehicles .... the rest is history.

Now where's that address for Dundee City Council.

Same old same old jasbar! The trade is fxxxxd and you want more cars on the road! get a grip min!

What will it take for you guys to realise that taxis don't pick up passengers, it's only drivers that do.

The number of taxis in the fleet is irrelevant. What matters is the number of qualified drivers.

The way forward, the fair way to limit those who can pick up, is through driver quality controls.

That way everyone has the opportunity, if they can meet the qualifications.

We've always argued that these driver quality controls should be strengthened.

We've always argued that as they are doing essentially the same job, these quality controls should be extended to private hire drivers.

What you're doing, and Dundee City Council if they go along with your stupid restriction, is to set up a situation where any expansion of the fleet will be with less qualified drivers. It's a dumbimng down of the service. And Edinburgh has already shown what happens when the service is dumbed down. Shown it because they ignored the Best Practice guide and it came back to bite two vulnerable females.

You guys are living in the past.

But what you are seeking is irrelevant. Because we're working to take away any option for councils to restrict, and we will achieve this.

Meanwhile, you're gonna encourage guys to pay a shortage premium if they want to operate their own plate. They're gonna end up shelling out big time.

And the council, knowing all this, WILL be liable to compensate them when their plate values disappear.

For Dundee Council to restrict at this time of economic hardship would be folly, placing public money at risk.

It's crazy.

Who are those that should be leaving?



That's the same ratio here and we're derestricted which only shows it doesn't necessarily slow down the growth of PH



You're quite right it is drivers that pick up passengers, but, when those drivers are able to license their own vehicle they will and so will every other driver that maybe currently on a PH system. How many drivers do you think will move over to HC if a restricted area becomes derestricted?



That is a fair way to limit drivers, but, those controls are not in place as yet and until such time as they are in place derestriction is a nightmare.



Again I agree with you. Our quality controls for the drivers of both HC and PH are the same here. I can bounce from one side of the trade to the other as often as I like here, but, because of that the quality of the driver requirement has no effect on limiting the number of drivers available for HC licenses. Due to the lack of rank work HC join circuits and need to. A lot of drivers don't see any benefit of being a HC driver hence the growth in the PH industry here

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Note to self: Just because it pops into my head does NOT mean it should come out of my mouth!!

am just ciurious jasbar were are u located are u scottish

You obviously haven't been reading all his posts. He works Edinburgh as far as I can make out and as to whether he's Scottish that's for him to answer, but, I don't see the relevance myself

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Note to self: Just because it pops into my head does NOT mean it should come out of my mouth!!

Drivers who have retired or moved on to other jobs.
Offices with fleets of taxis for rent which drivers with no plate have to drive.
People with no connection to the trade, other than holding plates.

These people are taking money directly from drivers' pockets to line their own.
They are not (as some would suggest) doing anyone a favour - except themselves.
If they weren't making a profit, they wouldn't be doing it.
Profit which is paid for by the guys in front of us at the rank (or above us on the sheet) who are working extra hours to earn it and making the rest of us wait longer for a job.
We all pay for this, not just the guys who have to rent.

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So if a driver has previously retired from a job (any job?) then they shouldn't become a taxi driver?

If it is a secondary job or the 2nd part of 2 part time jobs they shouldn't become a taxi driver?



There has to be some kind of market out there for those drivers that prefer to rent, you can't make them own thier own vehicle.



I can see your point, but, they provide to those that want to rent, they should at least have the plate fixed to a vehicle so the rental is for the licensed vehicle and not just the plate



How many drivers do this job as a favour for anybody else



So again it's down to money and how it affects your pockets and not necessarily down to a principal belief

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Note to self: Just because it pops into my head does NOT mean it should come out of my mouth!!

I didn't say that - you did.
By retired I meant retired from driving a taxi.



I didn't say that either.



Yet it seems acceptable to make them rent one and deny them their own?


I have no problem with a rental market but it needs to be a choice.
I do have a problem with a system which guarantees owners a steady stream of renters


We are not talking about drivers here. We are talking about owners.



No, it's down to both.
But I suppose your longing for restriction has nothing to do with money either?

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I don't have a longing for restriction, I'm not a taxi driver, I don't care. I don't agree with derestriction for lots of reasons, but, as I keep saying and nobody's listening it's only my opinion. I really don't think derestriction works for lots of reasons and none of them have anythin to do with 'my money'

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Note to self: Just because it pops into my head does NOT mean it should come out of my mouth!!

I didn't say anyone shouldn't be a taxi driver. You chose to interpret my words that way.
I thought most people would have understood the statement without further explaination.



And here's me thinking it was you misrepresenting my views again.
Your apology lacks sincerity.



So just so long as due process is applied, all is rosy in Toots' garden?



Yet restriction allows precisely this to happen and you support it.


My point exactly.
They leech from the people who do the work.
They support restriction because it keeps their drivers from setting up on their own, and it props up a business which would be swept away if left to market forces to decide.





So it's someone else who's been whittering on about PH circuits being swamped by HCs in the Wirral?
You may not be a taxi driver but this issue affects you too. Please don't insult our intelligence by saying otherwise.

Quote:

I don't agree with derestriction for lots of reasons, but, as I keep saying and nobody's listening it's only my opinion. I really don't think derestriction works for lots of reasons and none of them have anythin to do with 'my money'

So you don't agree with derestriction and you don't think it works?
Now there's a surprise. I think over your 7852 posts we have figured that one out for ourselves.

And of course it has nothing to do with the money your not making on that HC swamped PH circuit

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http://wingsoverscotland.com/ http://www.newsnetscotland.com/

Jasbar said



So I asked Jasbar



and you answered with this



I then asked you this question, hence the question marks. I'm sorry if felt my apology was insincere but that's why I put a wink at the end to show friendliness in the apology. I don't believe I misinterepted anything because I asked a question.





Yes, until due process is changed. Having said that due process isn't applied when it comes to the selling of plates is it? They allow companies to sell plates via the back door, which is wrong. The simple solution would be not to allow transfers from one person to another or one company to another. It's should be 'good will' that sells a business



Restriction doesn't allow it to happen, a lack of enforcing the law or not closing a loop hole allows it to happen.



Can you point me in the general direction of more than one derestricted area where market forces has done what everybody says it will?



That is definately something I have said, but, not for the reasons you think. I was merely pointing out that market forces do not come into play when an area is derestricted. If the radios from the ph circuit I work weren't in hcs they'd be inside phvs. I was using it as an example of what can happen when you derestrict, especially considering that you think it will slow the growth of ph down because it doesn't. Also because they have so many taxis on their circuit they can then call themselves 'taxi companies' and advertise as such



Well if you're going to have that attitude we might as well just form a list of those who agree with restriction and another for those who don't. We will all know where each of us stands on the issue and it won't have to be discussed any further



I don't recall ever saying I'm not making money. If I didn't make money I wouldn't do the job. I mean I'm not doing it out of charity or as favour am I. I'm also not dependant upon the money I earn as a driver

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Note to self: Just because it pops into my head does NOT mean it should come out of my mouth!!

Hey Jasbar, if you think this is a bloke - you're wrong

She reminds me of my ex. And she'll have the last word too......

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