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Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
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Author:  Sussex [ Mon Feb 04, 2013 8:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
Taxi-driver loses appeal

A taxi-driver whose licence was suspended has lost a court appeal against the decision. Robert Swaine of Hornby Close ,Walton had his appeal dismissed by Liverpool magistrates against the Taxis Sub-committee’s decision in October last year to suspend his licence for 28 days.

The Sub-committee heard that he was observed on four separate occasions between March to July in circumstances which led officers to consider he was “cherry-picking” fares. In each case he was seen late on Saturday nights in the city centre with his roof light extinguished when he should have had it illuminated so as to indicate he was available to be hired.

Although at the original sub-committee he refused to explain his behaviour to members, he admitted in court that he regularly kept his roof-light extinguished when he was working after midnight on Saturdays. He said this was to enable him to pick and choose his passengers on grounds of personal safety, not to get fares higher than those to which he was entitled and claimed this was common practice among drivers. However, the court rejected his arguments. His appeal was dismissed and he was ordered to pay the council £1,000 costs.

Councillor Christine Banks, chair of the Licensing Committee, said: “This is a clear warning that cherry-picking will not be tolerated. The regulations are quite clear -licensed taxis which are available for hire should have their lights on indicating that they are available for hire.

“In this case the sub-committee was given no explanation why the driver had his lights off but was still picking up passengers. The court did not accept his explanation about it being for safety reasons. Taxi drivers can refuse to accept passengers if there are reasonable ground for doing so – including personal safety – but they must make it clear to all passengers when they are available for hire. “If any driver feels a passenger may threaten their safety they should summon the police for assistance.”
Author:  wannabeeahack [ Tue Feb 05, 2013 12:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
I bet the council members wouldnt let just anyone into their house after midnight

if the "for hire" lights off hes not available, simples
Author:  skippy41 [ Tue Feb 05, 2013 1:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
If he had just said that he was there to collect an arranged booking, he may have got off with it
Author:  toots [ Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
skippy41 wrote:
If he had just said that he was there to collect an arranged booking, he may have got off with it


It's not acceptable that he should 'get off with it' they're terrors for doing it in Liverpool, light on or not.


Wannabe wrote:
I bet the council members wouldnt let just anyone into their house after midnight

if the "for hire" lights off hes not available, simples


It's hardly the same letting somebody in your house and letting them in your taxi when you're working. If he had not been available for work the council wouldn't have observed him picking up passengers :wink:
Author:  silvercab [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
I have a dislike for Cherry pickers, they aggravate the public, you can often see them in Manchester at Victoria station when the MEN arena has just kicked out, sat at the back of the rank on which a large queue of punters are waiting in the cold.

However as hackney drivers are governed by primary legislation and byelaws, what exactly was this driver charged with :?:
Author:  Sussex [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
silvercab wrote:
However as hackney drivers are governed by primary legislation and byelaws, what exactly was this driver charged with :?:

Being a very naughty boy. [-X
Author:  captain cab [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
Its commonplace in Liverpool - but here's an example taken from Liverpool CC website


33.CO.7074 - Consideration of a Taxicab Driver's Licence
◦View the background to item 33.

Minutes:

The Sub-Committee considered a taxicab driver’s licence No CO. 7074 were on Sunday 6th May 2012 at 03.40hrs, the driver was spokes to regarding his behaviour of being in a high profile area, at a time of peak demand for a taxi home, with his hackney carriages ‘for hire’ light off and on Sunday 23rd September 2012 at 16.50hrs, the driver was asked by an authorised officer to wait in his vehicle as he wanted to speak to him to inspect his vehicle and ask why he was waiting in a busy area with his ‘for hire’ light switched off, however the driver refused to comply with this request and drove away from the officer and two previous suspensions issued on 24th January 2007 and 8th October 2007 as the driver the driver was waiting in a high profile area with his ‘for hire’ light off whilst been approached by members of the public.


With the permission of the Sub-Committee the Licensing Officer and an Enforcement Officer addressed the meeting regarding the incidents.


With the permission of the Sub-Committee the driver addressed the meeting regarding their behaviour.

The driver left the room in order for the Sub-Committee to deliberate.

Resolved that the licence be suspended for a period of two weeks for the following reasons-



The Sub-Committee found that on both of the dates mentioned the driver’s behaviour was unreasonable and inappropriate and that gives reasonable cause to suspend the driver’s licence for a period of two weeks.

The Sub-Committee also took into account the fact that it has departed from the Council’s relevant guidance which recommends revocation of the licence bearing in mind the passage of time in relation to the two previous suspensions.
Author:  GBC [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
I often work with my light off, it's the best way to avoid t***s when the traffics slow. :?
Author:  GBC [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
So if I stop at Costa for a coffee in a 'high profile' area, and are then approached by people as my vehicle has TAXI written on it, I'm cherry picking according to Liverpools L.A???

Ffs, wonder if they pay as much attention to touts chancing their arm?

I already know the answer, they'll be like the PCO and hide. :roll:
Author:  captain cab [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
GBC wrote:
I often work with my light off, it's the best way to avoid t***s when the traffics slow. :?


and there's court cases on your side :wink:
Author:  toots [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 7:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
GBC wrote:
So if I stop at Costa for a coffee in a 'high profile' area, and are then approached by people as my vehicle has TAXI written on it, I'm cherry picking according to Liverpools L.A???

Ffs, wonder if they pay as much attention to touts chancing their arm?

I already know the answer, they'll be like the PCO and hide. :roll:


That's not what they were saying, this driver was seen to be picking up passengers so it's not as if he was having a break. The fact is that taxi drivers in Liverpool DO cherry pick and then they complain that customers call out of area ph to come and get them because it's so difficult to get back to Wirral after a night out. I'm not suggesting all drivers do but those that cherry pick deserve to be reprimanded the as those ph that pick illegally.
Author:  GBC [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
I've no doubt they do, but I'd rather hope they'd present better evidence than that.

I suspect if he'd been in a union or association he may have taken slightly better legal advice, any license suspension in London is appealed to a Mags Ct.

Put it another way, if I was having a coffee at midnight and someone approached me for a job out to Herts for a ton, I'd be taking them!
Author:  toots [ Sun Feb 10, 2013 7:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
GBC wrote:
any license suspension in London is appealed to a Mags Ct.


He did appeal :wink:
Author:  wannabeeahack [ Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
"Im sorry mate, im already booked"

I know scousers can be a bit slow on the uptake but he was a cabbie FFS


Lesson 1, keep your gobs shut, the correct answers was "I had a migraine and was going home"

Quote:
he admitted in court that he regularly kept his roof-light extinguished when he was working after midnight on Saturdays. He said this was to enable him to pick and choose his passengers on grounds of personal safety, not to get fares higher than those to which he was entitled and claimed this was common practice among drivers. However, the court rejected his arguments. His appeal was dismissed and he was ordered to pay the council £1,000 costs.
Author:  cabby john [ Sun Feb 10, 2013 2:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Liverpool cherry-picker loses court appeal
Quote:
Taxi drivers can refuse to accept passengers if there are reasonable ground for doing so – including personal safety – but they must make it clear to all passengers when they are available for hire. “If any driver feels a passenger may threaten their safety they should summon the police for assistance.”


What a crass statement!


Quote:
but they must make it clear to all passengers when they are available for hire



So you have to tell "Pyscho"......Yeh mate I am for hire - but I am not taking you because you are a nasty b*st**d.........and then
Quote:
If any driver feels a passenger may threaten their safety they should summon the police for assistance.”
...........so that they can help you out of your wheelchair OR into your coffin. :roll:






As others have alluded "I am on break" should and would be suffice - having said that if your booking fails to turn up, or is excessively late, do you go home - or take the next as it so happens..............out of town fare? The licensing laws as they stand are very much of a double standard! You can refuse an out of town fare with no real quibbles ( and I do not mean extreme distances), but do not refuse something that resembles a local fare = double standards in my book as they do permit you to refuse..... on their terms only.




Back a couple of years ago I got pulled in by our L.A, apparently reported by a member of the public for the very same thing (cherry picking)! finding out later that I am certain (99%) it was a driver of ours.

They would not tell me why I was being called in, so I went in very much cold, in terms of preparation. I was interviewed under "PACE"...................it is a long story so I will cut to the chase.

Their allegations was full of holes and inaccuracies, and I was able to answer their questions. However before I left the house I was looking for a note pad so that I could take notes during the forth coming meeting - I could not find my note book, but picked up my book that I use to note journeys along with the price charged (it is not as daft as it sounds). I was able to shoot down the allegation of cherry picking quite by accident - because I had a log of that nights work with me that showed that I had done numerous fares around about that time.............that were all local. What the driver had probably seen, was that I was in an area whereby it was not a recognised rank, I had turned a punter away............ for someone who was already booked, for a local drop #-o

I could not have possibly known what I was in for OR the questions that I was going to be asked, BUT, if you can show a work record for what ever shift in question, that shows you were taking local fares..................then you are pretty much home and dry, as it weakens their accusation.



Having said that the guy has not helped himself by ignoring an instruction from
Quote:
the driver was asked by an authorised officer to wait in his vehicle
.........that will have really p!$$ed them off, not the sharpest tool in the box is he :roll:
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