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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 1:43 pm 
More buses mean you won't have to wait in midnight hour
ALAN RODEN
TRANSPORT REPORTER (aroden@edinburghnews.com)
A MASSIVE expansion of Edinburgh's night bus network was announced today.

Lothian Buses is set to double the number of vehicles on key routes, as well as introducing new services to Dalkeith and Gorebridge.

The changes will come into effect a week tomorrow, on Sunday January 21.

The news means that residents in Restalrig, Lochend and parts of the Pennywell estate will have access to night buses for the first time.

But along with the expansion, the company has announced a fare rise of 50p - the first price increase since the network was revamped more than four years ago.

During that time, the number of routes on offer has soared from just five to 14.

There will also be improvements on certain daytime trips, particularly the popular 29 service from Gilmerton to Mayfield.

And there will be more buses on other popular routes, such as the 22 and 37, mainly in the mornings and late evenings.

Many of the changes are being funded by the Scottish Executive's route development grant, which aims to increase access to public transport.

Bill Campbell, Lothian Buses' operations director, said today: "We are delighted that our partnership with Midlothian and the city of Edinburgh councils has attracted bus route development grant funding from the Scottish Executive.

"This allows us to develop our existing bus services."

And he added: "In particular, our night buses network will be enhanced, with bus frequencies increased on some routes due to their increasing popularity, along with the introduction of an all-new service - the N3 - to Dalkeith.

"Passengers in Newtongrange and Mayfield will also benefit from the new half-hourly extension of service 29."

The Capital's night bus network was revamped in 2002, when the service numbers were changed to match their daytime counterparts.

There will now be a set fare of £2.50, or £1.50 for holders of Ridacards.

In comparison, taxi journeys from the city centre cost around £7 to Gorgie, £12 to Gilmerton and £20 to Penicuik.

Gavin Booth, chairman of passenger group Bus Users UK, said today: "The fare rise is not unreasonable, especially because Lothian Buses offers a reliable service that is a good deal cheaper than a taxi.

"The firm totally revamped its night bus network, and by aligning the service numbers, it makes it far easier for passengers to understand."

Pilmar Smith, chairman of Lothian Buses, added: "Our night buses network has really taken off since 2002.

"I am confident in saying that Edinburgh now has the biggest night bus network in the UK outside of London.

"Bus route development grant funding allows us to enhance our core network services, giving our passengers greater choice of routes and better frequencies."

Among the other timetable changes to be introduced next week will be a revised route for the MacTours number 69 bus. The service, which is mainly used by pensioners, can be hailed on the street.

The new route will include parts of Duddingston, where there were calls for better links to Portobello, but will omit Northfield Broadway and Portobello Road.

Local resident Ruth Kivlin, 68, from Lady Nairne Crescent, said this will cause problems for pensioners who need to travel to doctors' surgeries or the shops.

However, Lothian Buses said a recent survey showed that 99 per cent of passengers are heading to Portobello High Street, which is still on the route.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 1:53 pm 
Isn't it time for the taxi trade in Edinburgh to wake up and smell the coffee. here is another example, if one was needed, that the trade is squandering its market numerical presence. It is being reduced to becoming a bit part player.

I've been a cabby now for thirteen years.

When I started there were 1030 taxis on the road and around 100 private hire.

Now there are 1260 taxis and nearly 900 private hire.

In that time taxis have increased by around 20% while private hire have increased by over 800%. Yes that's right, over 800%.

Meanwhile the council is denying cabbies the right to operate their own taxis, and spending large sums of tax and licence payers money in legal costs through the courts to do so. Now we know why. It is using its power to regulate the taxi trade, and restrict it, so that it can develop its own bus service through the bus company it owns.

How can this be fair and equitable in an alleged free market economy?

If I want to operate a taxi, because of the artificial restriction of numbers, I now have to pay over £50,000 to buy a taxi licence that the legislation tells me is not legally transferable.

That's £50,000 just to secure my own employment. How can this be right?

So, I can't afford this? Then I have to pay up to £350 per week to buy myself a job. Meanwhile the council is abusing its power to restrict taxis to take work from the trade? How can this possibly be morally justifiable?

The council has a policy to restrict taxis, ostensibly because there is no significant unmet demand. Yet it can spend £582 million meeting the demand for transport by providing its tram system.

It can also spend £300,000 meeting demand through its new taxibus service to the airport, designed to compete directly against taxis and taking more work directly from the taxi trade.

Even when the council launched its expanded night bus service 4 years ago it increased the taxi tariff by 15%, an unprecedented move which was opposed by a significant part of the trade who recognise the detrimental effect it would have on passenger numbers. It did, and has. It was clearly done to increase the incentive for passengers to choose the night bus service over taxis. A clear abuse of a regulator with a conflicting interest.

By restricting taxi licences, by limiting the competition, by manipulating matters through its regulatory powers over the taxi trade isn't the council riding roughshod over every aspect of moral decency concerning free market principles?

Isn't it manifestly wrong for a council to own one form of transport while exerting control over, and at the expense, of another?

Is it any wonder that Cllrs Aitken and Wigglesworth refused to discuss these matters with us on Talk107?

We should remember that the new service is being launched through generous grants from the Scottish Executive, who are no doubt acting laudably in developing public transport routes.

While I have no difficulty with this, given that the council won't allow me to compete directly with them by securing my employment through funding my own vehicle (a very competitive £190 per week for a fully funded E7), isn't the reality, as things stand, that I, as a taxpayer, am effectively subsidising my own demise as a taxi driver?


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 2:05 pm 
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Are you suggesting deregulating the taxi trade would see an end to these schemes?

I think your mistaken.

CC

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 5:24 pm 
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captain cab wrote:
Are you suggesting deregulating the taxi trade would see an end to these schemes?

I think your mistaken.

CC


De-restriction with quality controls - a level playing-field for all.


You can't have your cake and eat it CC.


BTW, deregulation was never part of the package. A bit like false plate values.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 8:01 pm 
Isn't it amazing that there is still ignorance from alleged pillars of the taxi trade about the difference between deregulation and de-restriction.

No way do I want de-regulation. I do want de-restriction.

But it has to be said that the only way councils can introduce bus schemes like they have in Edinburgh is because it is not incumbent that they make a profit. Indeed they are subsidised to the hilt.

Worse though, Edinburgh council is deliberately stifling competition to the bus company they own because they regulate and restrict the competition.

That is the New Labour way. It is dishonest. It is immoral.

yet the convenor of the Regulatory Committee which does this work for the council, just happens to be a man of the cloth. Shouldn't he know better?

Oh, and to make matters worse, the overseer of the council, its political leader, just also happens to be a man of the cloth.

Two reverend gentlemen with no morality.

I can't wait to get before the Sheriff with these two gentlemen in the witness box explaining all of this.

Perhaps it should be live on the telly. It will make compulsive viewing.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 8:53 pm 
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Wtf are ECC doing, they moan about congestion, then add to it by putting more buss es on to block even more roads, they must be blind as well as stupid, it the dam buss-es that cause it all.
Is there any thing the cab drivers can do about it, like a day of action, a take over of the Parliament car park for instance or block princess street and the Lothian road and the bridges, ffs there is enough cabs to do it and at the rush hours, they could bring Edinburgh to a standstill. and keep doing it until some one takes notice,
Here's another idea block the Sheriff hall round about at the rush hours and see them squirm


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 9:51 pm 
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Skippy that requires 2 things.
1. Solidarity
2.Guts
According to Jasbar both requirments, notably lacking, so what now?
ORGANISE ORGANISE decisions are made by those that turn up!

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 10:55 pm 
One wee probelm skippy41.

The cooncil holds the sword of damocles over the trade.

Control over your own destiny is what you give up when those in power hold you to ransom.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:30 pm 
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jasbar wrote:
Isn't it amazing that there is still ignorance from alleged pillars of the taxi trade about the difference between deregulation and de-restriction.

No way do I want de-regulation. I do want de-restriction.

But it has to be said that the only way councils can introduce bus schemes like they have in Edinburgh is because it is not incumbent that they make a profit. Indeed they are subsidised to the hilt.

Worse though, Edinburgh council is deliberately stifling competition to the bus company they own because they regulate and restrict the competition.

That is the New Labour way. It is dishonest. It is immoral.

yet the convenor of the Regulatory Committee which does this work for the council, just happens to be a man of the cloth. Shouldn't he know better?

Oh, and to make matters worse, the overseer of the council, its political leader, just also happens to be a man of the cloth.

Two reverend gentlemen with no morality.

I can't wait to get before the Sheriff with these two gentlemen in the witness box explaining all of this.

Perhaps it should be live on the telly. It will make compulsive viewing.


Okay lets put it another way, WTF has taxi delimitation of numbers with quality control got to do with buses?

Are you suggesting ECC will magic the buses away and cease investment in that tram system?

Its like suggesting delimitation will bring world peace and stop terrorist attacks :roll:

CC

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:38 pm 
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captain cab wrote:
jasbar wrote:
Isn't it amazing that there is still ignorance from alleged pillars of the taxi trade about the difference between deregulation and de-restriction.

No way do I want de-regulation. I do want de-restriction.

But it has to be said that the only way councils can introduce bus schemes like they have in Edinburgh is because it is not incumbent that they make a profit. Indeed they are subsidised to the hilt.

Worse though, Edinburgh council is deliberately stifling competition to the bus company they own because they regulate and restrict the competition.

That is the New Labour way. It is dishonest. It is immoral.

yet the convenor of the Regulatory Committee which does this work for the council, just happens to be a man of the cloth. Shouldn't he know better?

Oh, and to make matters worse, the overseer of the council, its political leader, just also happens to be a man of the cloth.

Two reverend gentlemen with no morality.

I can't wait to get before the Sheriff with these two gentlemen in the witness box explaining all of this.

Perhaps it should be live on the telly. It will make compulsive viewing.


Okay lets put it another way, WTF has taxi delimitation of numbers with quality control got to do with buses?

Are you suggesting ECC will magic the buses away and cease investment in that tram system?

Its like suggesting delimitation will bring world peace and stop terrorist attacks :roll:

CC


don't forget, De-limitation will cure aids too, Cap.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:40 pm 
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If it will cure piles. I will push for it in Sefton as well . :oops: :lol:

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:43 pm 
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If customers had a choice over getting a cab nice and easily, or getting a bus full of idiots and being dropped off miles from your house late at night, then really it should be a no-brainer.

Alas the reason many cities now have late night buses is because many customers don't have that choice.

If there was an ample supply of cabs, then only the customers we don't want would use the buses.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 9:34 pm 
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Sussex, if the Edinburgh cabby's where to work at kicking out time there would be loads of cabs.
On many occasions i have had to pick up at 3.30am, and i have been mobbed and have had to lock my doors while waiting for my fare, and the reason there are no cabs is they are nearly all at Little France filling station,2 miles from the center, or some other place keeping out of the way.
So you are right as you say if there was loads of cabs there would be no problem


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 11:53 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
If customers had a choice over getting a cab nice and easily, or getting a bus full of idiots and being dropped off miles from your house late at night, then really it should be a no-brainer.

Alas the reason many cities now have late night buses is because many customers don't have that choice.

If there was an ample supply of cabs, then only the customers we don't want would use the buses.


But surely 60 - 70% of the country have delimited taxis.....I see equal amounts of subsidies for buses in those places too.

CC

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:51 am 
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captain cab wrote:
Sussex wrote:
If customers had a choice over getting a cab nice and easily, or getting a bus full of idiots and being dropped off miles from your house late at night, then really it should be a no-brainer.

Alas the reason many cities now have late night buses is because many customers don't have that choice.

If there was an ample supply of cabs, then only the customers we don't want would use the buses.


But surely 60 - 70% of the country have delimited taxis.....I see equal amounts of subsidies for buses in those places too.

CC


Who owns the buses in these areas?


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