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| Dundee: Another fine mess... http://www.taxi-driver.co.uk/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6734 |
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| Author: | Fae Fife [ Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Dundee: Another fine mess... |
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/output/2007 ... 8251t0.asp Courts give lift to taxi firm in row By Mark McLaughlin AN ATTEMPT by Dundee City Council to take one of the city’s largest taxi companies off the road has been temporarily thwarted by the courts. The council claim The Dundee Taxi Cab Company Ltd—known locally as 203020 Cabs—has been operating unlicensed vehicles for over a year and lodged a formal complaint with Tayside Police. However, 203020 obtained an interdict at Dundee Sheriff Court preventing police removing the taxi licence plates until an ongoing legal wrangle has been settled. Members of last week’s closed-doors licensing sub-committee heard that The Dundee Taxi Cab Company was actually liquidated in June last year. A leaked sub-committee report obtained by The Courier shows that the company that now operates 203020 is a wholly new company with the exact same name as the liquidated firm. All new taxi companies must register for taxi licences with the council, but rather than re-register 203020 kept the plates that were registered to the old company. The report states, “Although this new company has the same name as the old company, the law regards it as different entity and it cannot simply inherit the old company’s licences. “Licences are not legally transferable.” The company that now calls itself ‘The Dundee Taxi Cab Company’ was previously known as Marcam (Scotland) Ltd—but it assumed the title of the old taxi company two months after it was liquidated. When the council became aware of this fact it tried to remove the company’s right to operate and requested a clarification on whether it intended to re-register. However, the company is seeking a declaration from the court saying it is entitled to the original taxi licence plates. The council is defending this action, but 203020 has effectively been granted leave to operate until the matter has been adjudicated. In the meantime, the new Dundee Taxi Cab Company lodged an application for a fresh set of taxi licence plates—which came before the licensing sub-committee last Thursday. The sub-committee effectively rejected the new application on the grounds that 203020’s fleet of 71 vehicles does not conform to council standards. It is the policy of the licensing committee that new taxi licences should only be issued to those applicants wishing to place in service vehicles that conform to European regulations on safety and universal access. The 71 applications placed before the committee were for standard saloon cars that don’t conform to the European standard. However, the council provisionally granted 203020 new taxi licences provided it bought an entirely new fleet of European standard cars—which would require a massive capital investment from the company. The council operates a two-tier car licensing system—known as ‘white plates’ and ‘yellow plates’. The new 203020 have been given white plates, which have fewer restrictions on the type of car that can be used, but do not allow drivers to pick up passengers on the street. To do this they require yellow plates which give them full taxi licences. The issue over whether the reconstituted 203020 is entitled to the pre-liquidation yellow plates is pending at Dundee Sheriff Court. |
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| Author: | skippy41 [ Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Can you clarify this fa fife, they have either got a taxi licence or PH and what the hell has European standards got to do with the cars, all cars made in Europe have passed this standard so have the CC missed the plot |
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| Author: | Sussex [ Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
skippy41 wrote: they have either got a taxi licence or PH and what the hell has European standards got to do with the cars, all cars made in Europe have passed this standard so have the CC missed the plot
By the looks of things they have kept their taxi licenses untill the courts have looked at this situation. I expect the EU bit is the new rules about WAVs for new applications. Strange really cos the Doblo will never meet EU standards for WAVs in a million years, yet Dundee allow them. 
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| Author: | The Dawg [ Mon Aug 20, 2007 8:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
You can no longer put a Doblo on in Dundee ! If they have transferred the licences illegally from one company 2 another,,,surely their insurance will be null & void ?????? |
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| Author: | Sussex [ Mon Aug 20, 2007 8:29 pm ] |
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The Dawg wrote: surely their insurance will be null & void ??????
Not so sure about that. If they have got insurance saying the 71 cabs are insured, then the 71 cabs are insured. 
Whether the insurance pay out if they receive a claim is another thing.
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| Author: | Fae Fife [ Mon Aug 20, 2007 11:18 pm ] |
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skippy41 wrote: Can you clarify this fa fife, they have either got a taxi licence or PH and what the hell has European standards got to do with the cars, all cars made in Europe have passed this standard so have the CC missed the plot
They had taxi licences for the old company, but because it was liquidated they have to get licences for the new company, since as you know they can't be transferred. But the council will only hand out new licences for WAVs, so they either get a fleet of WAVs or they go PH with the same saloon fleet. The article is a bit unclear about the PH/white plates, but maybe the company applied for them just in case the council manages to take the taxi/yellow plates back. As the other posters have said, the European regs mentioned are just the WAV spec they use. I think they originally allowed Doblos, but then tightened things up so only TXs and Eurobuses could meet the spec, but I think the Doblo plates that were issued are allowed to carry on. |
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| Author: | skippy41 [ Tue Aug 21, 2007 12:02 am ] |
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Fae fife, I take it that Dundee City council have not read the latest from the disability forum that was held in Europe, that stated that there is no need for all wav's and that there must be a mixture of wav's and saloons as taxis, so as to benefit the majority of the disabled |
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| Author: | Fae Fife [ Tue Aug 21, 2007 12:13 am ] |
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I think they are going for a mixed fleet, but the problem is that if they give out 71 new saloon plate then that will set a precedent and everyone will want them. I don't know if the council would really like to give them the saloon plates again or whether the rest of the trade are swaying their minds, since they would love it if the company lost its yellow/taxi plates. Either way, it certainly doesn't look like the council are minded to give them yellow plates without a fight. |
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| Author: | dundee wav [ Tue Aug 21, 2007 12:52 am ] |
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http://www.eveningtelegraph.co.uk/outpu ... 723t0.shtm both reports mention (operating unlicensed vehicles for over a year)if 203020 told their insurance company they were running unlicensed vehilcles do you think the insurers would still cover them at that time? more importantly how many insurance claims have 203020 claimed over the past year? somebody from the council must be fed up of their antics to leak the information ,imagine going to all the bother of asking and attending a closed door meeting only to see all the info spread across the press, sort of takes away the purpose of a closed door meeting |
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| Author: | JD [ Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:11 am ] |
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Interesting happenings in Dundee, however it all could have been avoided if the vehicle licenses had been transfered in the correct way. Having said that, no doubt the court will advise us of the correct interpretation of the law of transfer in Scotland. Should be interesting. Regards JD |
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| Author: | gusmac [ Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:34 pm ] |
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Didn't this company have to go to the sheriff to get these licences in the first place? |
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| Author: | The Dawg [ Tue Aug 21, 2007 3:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
 Funnily enough yes ! 
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| Author: | Sussex [ Tue Aug 21, 2007 3:49 pm ] |
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gusmac wrote: Didn't this company have to go to the sheriff to get these licences in the first place?
And they did a lot of drivers elsewhere a big favour by clarifying the law. 
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| Author: | dundee wav [ Tue Aug 21, 2007 9:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
sussex you are right they did clarify the law to both cabbies and council,the problem was neither the mickey mouse taxi association nor the halfwit council bothered to check the laws, but you can bet your bottom dollar the council have had their people check the rules regarding this farce, they wouldnt dare try and pull 203020,s 71 plates unless they were sure, believe it or not i was one of about five cabbies who thought 203020 were going to win their plates last time,my money is on the council this time, during the liquidation process 203020 didnt stop trading even for a day, they are in the same building with the same staff the same plates and now the same company name, im not familar with liquidation rules but surely that cant be right |
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| Author: | gusmac [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 12:28 am ] |
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dundee wav wrote: sussex you are right they did clarify the law to both cabbies and council,the problem was neither the mickey mouse taxi association nor the halfwit council bothered to check the laws, but you can bet your bottom dollar the council have had their people check the rules regarding this farce, they wouldnt dare try and pull 203020,s 71 plates unless they were sure, believe it or not i was one of about five cabbies who thought 203020 were going to win their plates last time,my money is on the council this time, during the liquidation process 203020 didnt stop trading even for a day, they are in the same building with the same staff the same plates and now the same company name, im not familar with liquidation rules but surely that cant be right
It certainly smells a bit iffy. most of the bigger companies here have the cars and plates in a seperate limited company from the booking operation. I think that's to protect the plates if the booking operation goes t*ts up. |
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