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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 7:11 pm 
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TDO wrote:
GA wrote:
Thank you for pointing out that the process of change has taken many years.

The council were being bombarded from people trying to bully the council in a certain direction which benefited them through mailshots containing flawed and inaccurate information intended to further confuse issues, which led to a increase in numbers but a decrease in standards..

All of this needed to be discounted for the rubbish it was.

We then made proposals to council which were adopted or sent for appraisal, this process is ongoing.

Gateshead Council have recognised their own shortcomings and identified shortcomings within the trade as a result ........... they are now keen to change their policies to seek a way to form policies which ensure best possible service from the vehicles and drivers they licence.
In turn the drivers have acknowledged their own shortcomings and have agreed to work with the council to achieve the high standards our public should expect.

B. Lucky :D


So that's just a long-winded way of agreeing with me - councils don't always know best?

So you're contradicting yourself.


lol Nothing ever changes, we might as well just turn back the hands of time and re run some of the old threads. It would save us a lot of valuable time from going over the same redundent arguments of this lot.

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 7:23 pm 
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GA wrote:
All we have done is persistantly told the council that the decisions made locally are best made by the local authority concerned.


I thought you said councils know best? So why "PERSISTANTLY" tell Gatesead council for the last 6 years that their decision to remove quantity controls was wrong and they should re-restrict?

People reading this thread will no doubt get the impression that as far as you're concerned a council knows best but only if it suits you?

Quote:
So you can see there is no contradiction on my part.


lol, we can see the contradiction alright, you did a superb job of highlighting it.

JD


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 7:53 pm 
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JD wrote:
I thought you said councils know best? So why "PERSISTANTLY" tell Gatesead council for the last 6 years that their decision to remove quantity controls was wrong and they should re-restrict?


Because they have been given flawed and inaccurate information from people, often from other areas, encouraging them to allow Market Forces to decide upon numbers ................................. with no regard as to how the increased numbers are managed or how enforcement of policies and standards are maintained or bettered.

These people consider that their opinion is the ONLY opinion worth listening to, I on the other hand accept opposing opinion on the basis that it is based upon actual experience from another area.
I can quantify this statement by pointing out that I have never contacted an authority other than my own in respect of their licensing policies ............... could you make that same statement Mr JD.

The fact of the matter here is that I have only ever made comment about Gateshead ............. whereas most on here make comment about every other council in the country yet they still cannot convince their own council that what they are saying has any merit.

B. Lucky :evil:

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:36 pm 
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GA wrote:
JD wrote:
I thought you said councils know best? So why "PERSISTANTLY" tell Gateshead council for the last 6 years that their decision to remove quantity controls was wrong and they should re-restrict?


Because they have been given flawed and inaccurate information from people, often from other areas, encouraging them to allow Market Forces to decide upon numbers.


Didn't I read that you said they deregulated in 1999? If that is the case they must have made their decision based on what they thought was best for the authority at that time? You didn't agree with their decision, yet back in 1999 or whenever it was, the council obviously new best, so under your principal, "that councils know best", shouldn't you have taken your medicine and abided by their decision?

The fact is that the decision didn't sit well with you and probably many other Taxi owner/driver's in Gateshead, so you persistently sought to change council policy.

That's about the top and bottom of it, isn't it?

So where's the consistency in your argument?

We've been over these same arguments and deliberations time and time again in the past and I'm faaacked if were going to go through them again. So if you have anything new and constructive to contribute then we'll debate it, otherwise you can back track through all the old threads and indulge yourself in the same old answers that we're likeley to reiterate here?

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:41 pm 
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JD wrote:
GA wrote:
Is it ............... I can't find it. Maybe that's because no report has been written yet.


You've only been on here a few days and you're already confused?

Seeing as how you have a forgetful memory, here is what you said.

Quote:
We then made proposals to council which were adopted or sent for appraisal, this process is ongoing.


And here is what I said?

Yes the report is published on TDO and it will be interesting to see what becomes of it?

And just for your benefit, here is that report.

http://www.taxi-driver.co.uk/phpBB2/vie ... php?t=4339

JD



GA, I fully understood what you meant, simple really, when you're council has finished its review, it will publish its report on the findings,but as you say they can't publish a report until they have the review :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:44 pm 
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Quote:
Didn't I read that you said they deregulated in 1999? If that is the case they must have made their decision based on what they thought was best for the authority at that time? You didn't agree with their decision, yet back in 1999 or whenever it was, the council obviously new best, so under your principal, "that councils know best", shouldn't you have taken your medicine and abided by their decision?

The fact is that the decision didn't sit well with you and probably many other Taxi owner/driver's in Gateshead, so you persistently sought to change council policy.

That's about the top and bottom of it, isn't it?

So where's the consistency in your argument?

We've been over these same arguments and deliberations time and time again in the past and I'm faaacked if were going to go through them again. So if you have anything new and constructive to contribute then we'll debate it, otherwise you can back track through all the old threads and indulge yourself in the same old answers that we're likeley to reiterate here?

Regards

JD


I think you're wrong JD.

I think GA is stating locals are best placed to decide.


Quote:
shouldn't you have taken your medicine and abided by their decision


I dont think GA had any other option than to abide by their decision,do you?

However, disagreeing with their decision, and working towards a solution that would suit both parties is what seems to have been achieved.

CC

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 9:11 pm 
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captain cab wrote:
I think you're wrong JD.

I think GA is stating locals are best placed to decide.


Local what? I assume you mean Councils? That's exactly what I said. Angel believes in the theory that councils know best, doesn't he? So why didn't he put his faith in the council decision of 1999 or whenever it was?

I'm looking for consistency here I don't have a problem with anyone campaigning for change, no matter what that change might be? I do however have a distinct problem with someone who says "councils know best" then immediately a council makes a decision the individual doesn't like they immediately cry foul.

We've been through this time and time again and its about time it was put to bed. TDO or myself doesn't have a problem with democracy, if a person wants to effect change then they have the democratic right to try and accomplish change.

There are more important matters to resolve than what might or might not happen in Gateshead. If Mick wants to play the same old record over and over again like he did in the past then he is welcome to it but he wont get any response from me because its all been said before.

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:18 pm 
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I don't think there's any point in dissecting the above points in detail, because it's been done a squillion times before, but a few points might be in order.

- GA has been harping on about about rising numbers and standards in Gateshead for as long as I've been on taxi forums, ie about four and a half years. That's long before JD appeared on the scene, and even longer since JD produced his restrictions list. So to now attempt to blame this on JD is absolutely laughable.

- Gateshead have AFAIK always used DfT advice to justify derestriction, and I'm sure this was also well before JD appeared, so to say that Gateshead won't listen to outsiders is pure nonsense.

- And if GA doesn't like outsiders interfering, why has he sought the advice of the NTA or is maybe even a member these days? And if CC doesn't like outside interference, isn't it about time he resigned, since he seems quite adept at it?

- And let's not forget the days of TTFUK, when Mick and Nidge were regional reps for the forum and seemed to consider themselves a kind of International Rescue of the taxi world, flying in to bail out cabbies who were having trouble with their councils (I'm surprised they didn't call themselves Scott and Virgil, but fortunately even they drew the line at that :lol: )

- As for JD's document, as with anything else there may be the odd glitch, but to denegrate the whole thing on that basis is pathetic and represents nothing more than cluthching at straws. We might as well start trying to discredit each other by pointing out the typos and grammatical errors on here, but few are that sad, surely?

Thus it's the same old self-serving, hypocritical, obfuscatory, mountain-out-of-a-molehill bull that we've come to expect.

Plus ca change :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:22 pm 
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By the way, I was making the case for quality control on forums back in 2002 as well when GA was harping on about numbers control and little else.

And this site has also been making the case for QC from its inception, as has JD. But when did you ever hear anything from the likes of the NTA and T&G about QC?

Now GA's talking as if he invented QC :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:33 pm 
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TDO. when people say councils know best, what really should be said is that some councils that have a long proven working relationship with the taxi and private hire trade know best at local level,
There are some councils that are absolutely pathetic,

And no matter what system is in operation whether it be local or national it will still be managed at local level, I do not understand why you belittle local organisations and national organisations, For if they were not there representing the trade, and standing up to licensing offices who suddenly think they are god what would the trade do then?? :cry:


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:42 pm 
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So if they're self-serving and hypocritical then I'm not allowed to point that out?

No, of course I'm not :lol:

And your point about councils says little more than that if they do as you want then they know best, but if they don't then they're crap.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:54 pm 
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TDO wrote:
So if they're self-serving and hypocritical then I'm not allowed to point that out?

No, of course I'm not :lol:

And your point about councils says little more than that if they do as you want then they know best, but if they don't then they're crap.


If that is the way you wish to interpret my post then fine, I was beginning to give you more credit than that. eusasmiles.zip


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:57 pm 
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Well if you give me a minute then I'll be a bit more specific :D

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:59 pm 
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MR T wrote:
TDO. when people say councils know best, what really should be said is that some councils that have a long proven working relationship with the taxi and private hire trade know best at local level
,

ie, restricted taxi numbers
Quote:
There are some councils that are absolutely pathetic,


ie, unrestricted taxi numbers

:lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 11:06 pm 
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Quote:
Local what? I assume you mean Councils? That's exactly what I said. Angel believes in the theory that councils know best, doesn't he? So why didn't he put his faith in the council decision of 1999 or whenever it was?


You said that too? jeepers can we be pen pals :wink:

I think it was stated locals know best, who mentioned councils? :shock:


and tdo
Quote:
But when did you ever hear anything from the likes of the NTA and T&G about QC?


when did you ask? :wink:

CC

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