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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:55 pm 
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Location: Chester
About a year ago my local council comissioned a survey to see if there was any unmet demand by the Hackneys in our city.It was decided to keep the restrictions in place and to do another survey in one year - which is now.

I myself am in favour of de restriction because I think that it should be a free and open market and I would myself like to run a Hackney in this city.

My reasons for such are as a private hire driver I feel that I could offer a better service to the public and would not be held to ransom by the greedy PH operators who are flooding the market.There is a big unmet demand for good quality and knowledgable drivers in this city and I feel that by restricting numbers I am being prevented being able to operate a good quality and well recognised trade by the unfair system.

I feel that by restricting the number of Hackneys the business is just passing over to the lower quality high number of private hire a group of which I belong to but not through choice.When will people realise that it is quality and not quantity that counts.

As for the last unmet demand survey I would say that it was a bit flawed given that the Hackney drivers knew when it was taking place and ensured that every cab was working and taking up a space on a rank.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 5:35 pm 
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JDBubbles wrote:
About a year ago my local council comissioned a survey to see if there was any unmet demand by the Hackneys in our city.It was decided to keep the restrictions in place and to do another survey in one year - which is now.


I see you and I have something in common but could this be a wind-up? lol I'm interested to know to which city you refer?

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 5:44 pm 
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Location: Chester
I am referring to Chester and I am not in the habit of winding people up.

I have just returned a form to the council asking for my comments as someone who has shown an interest.
I honestly feel that as a Private hire driver for 11 years that I could better serve our city and its visitors driving a Hackney.I actually enjoy my job and the interaction with the passengers and show a genuine interest in the history of this city.I think that given the right circumstances I could be a great ambassador,without having to line the pockets of the greedy operators.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 6:13 pm 
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JDBubbles wrote:
I am referring to Chester and I am not in the habit of winding people up.


lol I was refering to your nick not your comments.

Why don't you contact Peter Willet the LO of Chester and ask him if the council still intend to review their policy this year, as was stated at their committee meeting on the seventh of April last year? Chester issued 4 additional licenses last year, what criteria did they use?

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 6:25 pm 
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Location: Chester
JD wrote:

Why don't you contact Peter Willet the LO of Chester and ask him if the council still intend to review their policy this year, as was stated at their committee meeting on the seventh of April last year? Chester issued 4 additional licenses last year, what criteria did they use?

Regards

JD


I have already contacted him and the policy is under review as we speak.The criteria used to issue the last 4 was any interested parties applied for a licence which were then whittled down and chosen for suitability by the licencing commitee.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 6:41 pm 
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JDBubbles wrote:


I have already contacted him and the policy is under review as we speak.The criteria used to issue the last 4 was any interested parties applied for a licence which were then whittled down and chosen for suitability by the licencing commitee.


Well it appears you have everything in hand, all you have to do now is either wait for the councils decision, or challenge their survey on the grounds it is now historic? Unless of course you can prove the survey to be flawed, which will no doubt be both time consuming and expensive.

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 6:54 pm 
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Location: Chester
JD wrote:
JDBubbles wrote:


I have already contacted him and the policy is under review as we speak.The criteria used to issue the last 4 was any interested parties applied for a licence which were then whittled down and chosen for suitability by the licencing commitee.


Well it appears you have everything in hand, all you have to do now is either wait for the councils decision, or challenge their survey on the grounds it is now historic? Unless of course you can prove the survey to be flawed, which will no doubt be both time consuming and expensive.

Regards

JD


I will as you say just have to wait,if they decide to stay as things are then another survey would not be carried out for another 3 years.In this event then I would be extremely lucky to get one of the 4 new release plates otherwise would have to wait another 3 years.In my opinion I would be very surprised if the council here do decide to deregulate.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 6:58 pm 
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JDBubbles wrote:


I will as you say just have to wait,if they decide to stay as things are then another survey would not be carried out for another 3 years.In this event then I would be extremely lucky to get one of the 4 new release plates otherwise would have to wait another 3 years.In my opinion I would be very surprised if the council here do decide to deregulate.


I think you might find the matter will be taken out of their hands sooner than you think?

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:07 pm 
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JD wrote:

I think you might find the matter will be taken out of their hands sooner than you think?

Regards

JD

Please enlighten me just in case I feel the need to go and buy plate from one of the existing owners.

Also the form I sent back with my comments about unmet demand was to be returned by sept 1st so sooner or later a decision will have to be made.
:?


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:13 pm 
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JDBubbles wrote:
JD wrote:

I think you might find the matter will be taken out of their hands sooner than you think?

Regards

JD

Please enlighten me just in case I feel the need to go and buy plate from one of the existing owners.

Also the form I sent back with my comments about unmet demand was to be returned by sept 1st so sooner or later a decision will have to be made.
:?


If you were asked for comments it looks like the issue is under scrutiny as you rightly said. Which can't be a bad thing for you.

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:23 pm 
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Location: Chester
The comments were asked for the following 2 options

Option 1

Remove the existing restrictions on the number of Hackney Carriage Vehicle Licenses issued bu Chester City Council but maintain quality controls and ensure all vehicles are wheelchair accessible.


Option 2

To continue to restrict the number of Hackney Carriage Vehicle Licenses issued by Chester City Council and to conduct an Unmet demand survey every three years(to be funded by the council or by an increase in licensing fees)

I was also asked to comment on whether there was adequate provision for disabled people late at night.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:46 pm 
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JDBubbles wrote:
The comments were asked for the following 2 options

Option 1

Remove the existing restrictions on the number of Hackney Carriage Vehicle Licenses issued bu Chester City Council but maintain quality controls and ensure all vehicles are wheelchair accessible.


Option 2

To continue to restrict the number of Hackney Carriage Vehicle Licenses issued by Chester City Council and to conduct an Unmet demand survey every three years(to be funded by the council or by an increase in licensing fees)

I was also asked to comment on whether there was adequate provision for disabled people late at night.


There was a very interesting race discrimination case in Bristol back in 1997 where the council had a policy of only transfering plates to Widows, Widowers or close relatives. A black person complained that this was discriminatory and the tribunal found in his favour. Bristol immediately ditched the policy and lifted quantity controls.

The black person still couldn't get a license because he couldn't afford to buy a cab. The reason being that Bristol council introduced a policy that all vehicles had to be wheelchair compliant with an age stipulation. The applicant took the council back to the tribunal and tried to say he was still being discriminated agaisnt. However since the council had deregulated he no longer had a case.

The point I'm trying to make is that where a licensing authority practices a policy of only allowing plates to be transfered to a certain section of society such as close friends or relatives then that policy in itself is discriminatory under section s.1(1)(b) Race Relations Act 1976.

Intriguing isn't it. lol

The original tribunal found as follows.

The policy of allowing hackney carriage licences to be transferred to a widow widower or close relative was found to be discriminatory on the grounds of race given the historical context. The time-scale was an important factor affecting the justification of the discrimination for the purposes of s.1(1)(b) Race Relations Act 1976.

Now I have an inkling that the close relation policy of Bristol council may have been imaterial and the actual policy of restriction was the main factor. I would love to get my hands on the Bristol tribunal report but if you go off what Rodgers said in the Dublin case regarding the European factor allied to what transpired in Bristol then I think you may have a mighty strong case under the 1976 race relations act without having the need to spend thousands in a court of law.

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 9:03 pm 
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Location: Chester
JD wrote:
JDBubbles wrote:
The comments were asked for the following 2 options

Option 1

Remove the existing restrictions on the number of Hackney Carriage Vehicle Licenses issued bu Chester City Council but maintain quality controls and ensure all vehicles are wheelchair accessible.


Option 2

To continue to restrict the number of Hackney Carriage Vehicle Licenses issued by Chester City Council and to conduct an Unmet demand survey every three years(to be funded by the council or by an increase in licensing fees)

I was also asked to comment on whether there was adequate provision for disabled people late at night.


There was a very interesting race discrimination case in Bristol back in 1997 where the council had a policy of only transfering plates to Widows, Widowers or close relatives. A black person complained that this was discriminatory and the tribunal found in his favour. Bristol immediately ditched the policy and lifted quantity controls.

The black person still couldn't get a license because he couldn't afford to buy a cab. The reason being that Bristol council introduced a policy that all vehicles had to be wheelchair compliant with an age stipulation. The applicant took the council back to the tribunal and tried to say he was still being discriminated agaisnt. However since the council had deregulated he no longer had a case.

The point I'm trying to make is that where a licensing authority practices a policy of only allowing plates to be transfered to a certain section of society such as close friends or relatives then that policy in itself is discriminatory under section s.1(1)(b) Race Relations Act 1976.

Intriguing isn't it. lol

The original tribunal found as follows.

The policy of allowing hackney carriage licences to be transferred to a widow widower or close relative was found to be discriminatory on the grounds of race given the historical context. The time-scale was an important factor affecting the justification of the discrimination for the purposes of s.1(1)(b) Race Relations Act 1976.

Now I have an inkling that the close relation policy of Bristol council may have been imaterial and the actual policy of restriction was the main factor. I would love to get my hands on the Bristol tribunal report but if you go off what Rodgers said in the Dublin case regarding the European factor allied to what transpired in Bristol then I think you may have a mighty strong case under the 1976 race relations act without having the need to spend thousands in a court of law.

Regards

JD

If the only restriction was that of providing a brand new cab then I would happily buy one without complaint.As for the legal stuff it tends to baffle me quite easily.I would rather stay as a PH driver than waste my life chasing the council down the legal route.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 9:13 pm 
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JDBubbles wrote:

If the only restriction was that of providing a brand new cab then I would happily buy one without complaint.As for the legal stuff it tends to baffle me quite easily.I would rather stay as a PH driver than waste my life chasing the council down the legal route.


I don't blame you one bit.

Put it this way, time is rapidly running out for the 28% of councils that still restrict numbers and they know it. Those that don't introduce a high standard quality regime now will suffer the consequencies when deregulation hits them and I'm not talking just vehicle quality.

Regards

JD


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 9:59 pm 
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Location: Chester
JD wrote:
JDBubbles wrote:

If the only restriction was that of providing a brand new cab then I would happily buy one without complaint.As for the legal stuff it tends to baffle me quite easily.I would rather stay as a PH driver than waste my life chasing the council down the legal route.


I don't blame you one bit.

Put it this way, time is rapidly running out for the 28% of councils that still restrict numbers and they know it. Those that don't introduce a high standard quality regime now will suffer the consequencies when deregulation hits them and I'm not talking just vehicle quality.

Regards

JD

I totally agree with you,by restricting the numbers it has just seen a mushroom effect of all the lower quality cars on PH taking control of all the work It grieves me to see what was once a valid and reliable service turning into a free for all with waning standards - I take pride in my job and do it well and it annoys me when so many drivers doing the same job turn up in rust buckets that last saw a sponge about 5 years ago.The fact that there are so few Hackneys just increases the problem.By the time we actually get to de restriction all the work will have been swallowed up by the Greengrasses in their 10 year old mondeos.


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