Taxi Driver Online

There is every possibility that the local Chester Taxi association will mount a Judicial Review within the next ten or 14 days. This is dependent on Barristers advice on whether or not they have a winnable case?

This thread will be used to debate the merits and outcome of the judicial review and any Chester cabby is most welcome to post their opinions on the subject.

The outline to the decision is that Chester council has exercised its right to change their policy on Taxi licensing and remove quantity controls. Chester had a policy of budgeting for a survey of unmet demand by increasing hackney carriage proprietor fees in order to pay for the survey. Such a policy did not prohibit the council from exercising its right to amend or change their quantity control policy but if the council did change its policy then it has to decide what to do with the survey money that in effect is ring fenced. The council has realised that because of the change of policy the money collected for any future survey should be returned. I understand that process is now under way.

The point of these deregulation judicial reviews which are always brought by those who are aggrieved at the decision, is to determine whether or not the decision was arrived at lawfully. I obviously don't have all the information at hand to determine that but I shall try my best to obtain it.

We all know what happened in Watford where the council consultation process was deemed to be flawed but it did not stop the council from getting it right the second time and still exercising its discretion to deregulate.

Some facts to consider are,

has an aggrieved applicant ever "ultimately" been successful in stopping a council from exercising its right to remove restrictions The answer is no.

Has an aggrieved applicant ever been successful in obtaining an order prohibiting a Council from issuing new hackney carriage licenses' until they had completed a full and adequate consultation process? The answer is yes. The most recent being Watford.

What are the chances of Chester cab drivers "ultimately" winning a decision over the council. Nil.

What are the chances of Chester cab drivers getting a stay of license issue on first hearing? In this case Remote to Possible.

What are the chances of Chester cab drivers being granted a judicial review? Remote to Possible.

What are the established grounds for judicial review? In a nutshell there are three basic grounds for judicial review they are

(1) Illegality.
(2) Fairness.
(3) Irrationality and proportionality.

Each has its own definitions contained within each category but the court has a discretion to refuse permission for judicial review, or a remedy, even when a public law wrong has been committed and when decisions are made they will often be remitted back to the decision maker with guidance from the court, rather than being quashed.

One assumes that legitimate expectation may play a great part in this judicial review if it can be proved that the Chester taxi proprietors had a legitimate expectation that the council would not make a decision on a change of policy until they had held a survey.

If a court comes down on the side of legitimate expectation then there is every possibility that the court might instruct the council to consult the public. However a court will probably not advise a council how that process should be undertaken and therefore a council may merely consult by way of questionnaire and letter and then consider the evidence and make their decision. On the other hand the court might dismiss the point of legitimate expectation if the council has consulted properly and made its decision fairly.

There are many imponderables and it will be interesting to see the allegations.

Regards

JD

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As far as I know, such funds, whatever they may be called or known as locally, are collected under the legislation that allows for licensing fees.

Thers is no other way to my knowledge that any such 'SUD survey fees' could be lawfully collected by the council.

If that is the case, how can a council legally return licence fees.

The only way such fees can be 'returned' is by reduction of future licensing fees.

This was the only way licensing fees could be 'returned' to the trade, including PH when, about 7-10 years ago, the Birmingham trade discovered massive overpayments of licensing fees that had been regularly transferred to the councils' General Funds.

Pray tell me more? How have Chester circumvented the process?

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Kind regards,

Brummie Cabbie.

Type a message, post your news,
Disagree with other members' views;
But please, do have some decorum,
When debating on the TDO Forum.

I understand the fee was in addition to the licensing fees specifically to pay for a survey which I imagine was an offer made by the local trade. This figure I assume was then ring fenced to pay for any survey should the council decide to have one? Since the council decided not to have one then the money was a surplus and it would appear to me they realised they had no legitimate right to retain it. I suppose its similar to paying for a test and getting a refund if the council can't accommodate that test.

Regards

JD

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The council had no legal way of collecting this money in the first place either.

They appear to have acted as a bank for the deposit of moneis.

Weird situation.

Also doesn't it say somewhere in an OFT or DfT publication, that such practices should be avoided, i.e. any survey should be paid for out of council funds & not 'directly' financed by the trade.

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Kind regards,

Brummie Cabbie.

Type a message, post your news,
Disagree with other members' views;
But please, do have some decorum,
When debating on the TDO Forum.

A council can legally ask for a refundable deposit on return of license plates so I can't see why they couldn't ask for a returnable deposit for payment of a survey. St Eds did a similar thing. Which legislation did you say prohibits a council from doing that?

Regards

JD

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Well I'm glad about your first sentence, because I have been thinking of asking that question on this forum for some time.

Do councils that ask for plate deposits require substantial deposits to try & deter dealing in plates & to try to eradicate plate values?

With regard to the question of collecting funds other than licensing fees, I just can't see how they can do this under any of the licensing legislation. They are allowed to collect licensing fees. Where else does it allow the councils' licensing department to collect other monies for whatever purpose?

_________________
Kind regards,

Brummie Cabbie.

Type a message, post your news,
Disagree with other members' views;
But please, do have some decorum,
When debating on the TDO Forum.

Chester Hackney Carriage Licensing Fees

The following fees were correct at April 2007

New Hackney Carriage Vehicle Application (Under 8 Years Old) (This includes a £40 deposit for the Licence Plates which is refundable upon surrender of the Licence) For 2007, this fee also includes pound 129 to pay for an Unmet Demand Survey. For more information, please visit the Hackney Carriages Homepage. pound; 434.00 2007 Only 1 Year

Renew Hackney Carriage Vehicle Licence (Under 8 Years Old) Includes Unmet Demand Survey Fee (pound;129) pound;394.00 2007 Only 1 Year

New Hackney Carriage Vehicle Application (Over 8 Years Old) (This includes a £40 deposit for the Licence Plates which is refundable upon surrender of the Licence) For 2007, this fee also includes pound; 64.50 to pay for an Unmet Demand Survey. For more information, please visit the Hackney Carriages Homepage. pound; 237.00 2007 Only 6 Months

Renew Hackney Vehicle Licence (Over 8 Years Old) For 2007, this fee also includes £64.50 to pay for an Unmet Demand Survey. For more information, please visit the Hackney Carriages Homepage. pound; 197.00 2007 Only 6 Months
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If that is what it reads, they have collected the money by way of licensing fees & there is NOTHING IN THE LEGISLATION that allows the council to refund the money.

They can only 'refund' by way of reduced future licensing fees.

They have also made a 'rod for their own back' by charging differing amounts for the survey, depending on the grade of licence that was paid for.

It gets weirder & weirder.

_________________
Kind regards,

Brummie Cabbie.

Type a message, post your news,
Disagree with other members' views;
But please, do have some decorum,
When debating on the TDO Forum.

I imagine taxi owners offered to pay for a survey because the council weren't going to have one. In that case I assume it was agreed by taxi owners to pay the agreed sum on an annual basis when license fees were due and that the money would be kept separate should the council have a survey. That is my assumption and St Eds did a similar thing. I'll find out on Monday unless someone provides the details before then.

Regards

JD

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If my assumption is right then the council haven't charged anything because the payment is voluntary. If proprietors don't want a survey then they could withdraw their offer to pay.

If a council had a policy of conducting a survey on a regular basis out of licensing fees then they wouldn't need to separately itemise the fee for a survey. I think if an agreement was reached by the local cab trade that the council should collect the money and hold it then I would have thought that was an entirely different proposition than charging a set license fee.

Without knowing the full details it is impossible to determine who instigated what?

Regards

JD

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I was thinking that if the charge was a part of the licensing fees then the drivers don't have a leg to stand on because the payment of a license fee does not make the decision making of a council, impotent. However if the money was collected on the basis that the council had said it was going to have a survey before it made any decision on deregulation then that might be of more assistance to the cab drivers?

Regards

JD

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It would appear the issue stems back to 2004 when Chester were on the verge of removing quantity controls. The local Taxi association in desperation must have pleaded with the council to hold a survey and they would pay for it. How it came to be part of the license fee structure is still unclear.
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March 2005

4.1 This issue was first considered by Licensing Board on 7 September 2004 when the Board resolved that ….“Cabinet be recommended to remove the existing restrictions on the number of taxi licences issued by the Chester City Council, but with quality criteria requiring brand new, black, approved purpose-built vehicles with full wheelchair accessibility being retained”.

4.2 Cabinet’s decision on 9 September 2004 was:-

(1) “The commissioning of an unmet demand survey at a cost of £15,000- £20,000 be authorised.

(2) The offer by Chester Hackney Carriage Association to meet the costs of the survey be accepted and confirmed in writing.
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Regards

JD

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By the way I forgot to add, that the solicitor acting for the local Chester hackney carriage association was sent a CD containing volumes of case law retrieved from TDO. No surprises who sent it.

Regards

JD

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Paranoid or what .... I think you'll find she has a copy of the Book....

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Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!

I know exactly what she has, she told me herself the day she received it.

We had a very interesting conversation would you like to know what she said?

Regards


JD

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