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We have a driver who has today had his licence revoked by the council. He has 21 days to appeal. Anyone know a good solicitor to contact for advice?

Quote:

. My feelings are that the council, if they thought that he was not fit and proper, should have revoked his licence when he informed them about this over a year ago.

Instead they do it now but still tell him he can keep working for the next 21 days because of the appeals process. So he is still fit and proper at the moment but he won't be in 21 days time.

Good point Skippy, I never thought about that one. Yes he was issued a renewal in April this year. He informed the council before Christmas last year.

grandad wrote:

Good point Skippy, I never thought about that one. Yes he was issued a renewal in April this year. He informed the council before Christmas last year.

Was he convicted before his licence was renewed in April?

gusmac wrote:

grandad wrote:

Good point Skippy, I never thought about that one. Yes he was issued a renewal in April this year. He informed the council before Christmas last year.

Was he convicted before his licence was renewed in April?

No he was convicted a few weeks ago but he had informed the council over a year ago that he was pleading guilty.

Dont forget to inform him whats good for the goose is good for the gander,
I wonder if that other company was keeping accurate books for the tax man :wink:

I mean paying in cash and not declaring it :wink:

He has been convicted of benefit fraud whilst working for another company. Basically the other company were paying him cash in hand whilst he was claiming benfits. When he left them they grassed him up to the benefits people. He pleaded guilty and is paying back the overpayment of benefit. He kept the licensing officer informed from the outset. He had to appear before the council this morning and they decided to revoke his licence. I have sugested to him that he may be able to appeal but I am not sure how to go about it. My feelings are that the council, if they thought that he was not fit and proper, should have revoked his licence when he informed them about this over a year ago. Instead they do it now but still tell him he can keep working for the next 21 days because of the appeals process. So he is still fit and proper at the moment but he won't be in 21 days time.

Author:	grandad [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 3:56 pm ]
Post subject:	licence revoked
We have a driver who has today had his licence revoked by the council. He has 21 days to appeal. Anyone know a good solicitor to contact for advice?

Author:	Sussex [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:31 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
grandad wrote: We have a driver who has today had his licence revoked by the council. He has 21 days to appeal. Anyone know a good solicitor to contact for advice? I would go for a good criminal defence lawyer, as they know the inns and outs of the local court better than anyone. You will find their offices right next to your local Magistrates Court, at a good guess. If you want a licensing lawyer then the pages of PHM will give you a few pointers. If the alleged offence(s) are license offence(s), then maybe a licensing lawyer would be best, if not then go for a local criminal defence lawyer. Don't get the local lawyer who does the mortgages or estates, you need one that rucks hard.

Author:	skippy41 [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:34 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
What is he alleged to have done

Author:	grandad [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
He has been convicted of benefit fraud whilst working for another company. Basically the other company were paying him cash in hand whilst he was claiming benfits. When he left them they grassed him up to the benefits people. He pleaded guilty and is paying back the overpayment of benefit. He kept the licensing officer informed from the outset. He had to appear before the council this morning and they decided to revoke his licence. I have sugested to him that he may be able to appeal but I am not sure how to go about it. My feelings are that the council, if they thought that he was not fit and proper, should have revoked his licence when he informed them about this over a year ago. Instead they do it now but still tell him he can keep working for the next 21 days because of the appeals process. So he is still fit and proper at the moment but he won't be in 21 days time.

Author:	skippy41 [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:29 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
grandad wrote: He has been convicted of benefit fraud whilst working for another company. Basically the other company were paying him cash in hand whilst he was claiming benfits. When he left them they grassed him up to the benefits people. He pleaded guilty and is paying back the overpayment of benefit. He kept the licensing officer informed from the outset. He had to appear before the council this morning and they decided to revoke his licence. I have sugested to him that he may be able to appeal but I am not sure how to go about it Quote: . My feelings are that the council, if they thought that he was not fit and proper, should have revoked his licence when he informed them about this over a year ago. Instead they do it now but still tell him he can keep working for the next 21 days because of the appeals process. So he is still fit and proper at the moment but he won't be in 21 days time. If he has been issued with a licence since he informed them, I think he has a dam good case, they should have if they where going to do it, done it at the time, and not waited more than a year after the event. I just wonder if that other company failed to pay the min wage

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Author:	grandad [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:32 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
Good point Skippy, I never thought about that one. Yes he was issued a renewal in April this year. He informed the council before Christmas last year. The other company are under some kind of investigation regarding the minimum wage because the owner sent a letter to the benefits people stating that he was being paid £3.50 per hour plus 20pence per job that he took over the phone. He was working the switch at the time.

Author:	gusmac [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
grandad wrote: Good point Skippy, I never thought about that one. Yes he was issued a renewal in April this year. He informed the council before Christmas last year. Was he convicted before his licence was renewed in April?

Author:	skippy41 [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:37 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
Dont forget to inform him whats good for the goose is good for the gander, I wonder if that other company was keeping accurate books for the tax man I mean paying in cash and not declaring it

Author:	grandad [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:37 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
gusmac wrote: grandad wrote: Good point Skippy, I never thought about that one. Yes he was issued a renewal in April this year. He informed the council before Christmas last year. Was he convicted before his licence was renewed in April? No he was convicted a few weeks ago but he had informed the council over a year ago that he was pleading guilty.

Author:	skippy41 [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:41 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
grandad wrote: gusmac wrote: grandad wrote: Good point Skippy, I never thought about that one. Yes he was issued a renewal in April this year. He informed the council before Christmas last year. Was he convicted before his licence was renewed in April? No he was convicted a few weeks ago but he had informed the council over a year ago that he was pleading guilty. An appeal to a magistrates should be suffice, to start with, and as you say he has kept the council informed all the way so he could get it back He needs to do this quickly, you could also go with him as a character witness

Author:	grandad [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
skippy41 wrote: Dont forget to inform him whats good for the goose is good for the gander, I wonder if that other company was keeping accurate books for the tax man I mean paying in cash and not declaring it The books were taken away for checking a while ago. They have told drivers that they need to work out the hours that they have worked from their takings and divide that by £5.83 so that it looks like they are earning the minimum wage. A driver has shown me her working out for this. she showed me her October and 2 weeks from November workings. I did point out to her that the minimum wage went up at the start of October so everything was wrong.

Author:	Sussex [ Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:38 am ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
grandad wrote: He has been convicted of benefit fraud whilst working for another company. Basically the other company were paying him cash in hand whilst he was claiming benfits. When he left them they grassed him up to the benefits people. He pleaded guilty and is paying back the overpayment of benefit. He kept the licensing officer informed from the outset. He had to appear before the council this morning and they decided to revoke his licence. I have sugested to him that he may be able to appeal but I am not sure how to go about it. My feelings are that the council, if they thought that he was not fit and proper, should have revoked his licence when he informed them about this over a year ago. Instead they do it now but still tell him he can keep working for the next 21 days because of the appeals process. So he is still fit and proper at the moment but he won't be in 21 days time. Were they aware fully of his indiscretions when they re-licensed his driver's badge?

Author:	Sussex [ Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:45 am ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
I've just scrolled down and seen the further posts. He wasn't found guilty until after his re-license, so I think that avenue isn't a good one. However I would appeal on the basis the council's actions are disproportionate to the 'crime'. He will need a good lawyer, and I don't think it matters if it's a specialist licensing one, or a criminal one. But others may have a different view. If I was a lawyer I would go along on the basis of how will he repaid the money back if he is not working, as well as being a drain on the public purse. I would also like to see the council's enforcement code, and see where the revocation on this issue fits into that.

Author:	MR T [ Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:54 am ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
Grandad.... you're getting some bad advice..... firstly the council had to renew his licence even though a case was pending...... which they did... once his case had been heard and he had been convicted... a decision at that point had to be taken.... you say he went before a panel.... and they listen to his case.. and then after hearing the evidence ... made the decision to revoke his licence.... procedure wise they seem to have done everything correctly...... the only way the courts will overturn the council's decision is if the council has acted improperly.or disproportionately.... that is what he needs to check.....

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Author:	Nidge [ Tue Dec 13, 2011 7:54 am ]
Post subject:	Re: licence revoked
He's not a bad man for doing that and a decent Magistrate will allow his appeal. They don't like seeing people out of work. I remember when I took Ashfield Council to the Crown Court on appeal, the judge ripped Jim Mortell (Ashfields Licensing Officer at the time) a new pooh hole he said, I allow Midlanders appeal and Mr Mortell, I expect his drivers badge to be waiting for him when he returns to his home.