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LA have written, seems theyve been overcharging since 2009

something to do with not advertising plate and ops licence increases (badge increases dont need to be advertised?)

only problem is how the hell do i know the start and finish dates for plates/ops licences? ive got the reciepts

the forms for a refund asks for start/finish dates

Our council have kept quiet about it and have started advertising this year :sad:

Our council have kept quiet about it and have started advertising this year :sad:

although a council has a statutory power to levy a fee this does not give it an absolutely free hand in relation to the scale of the fee that is levied.the impact of any increase upon the livelihood of those affected has to be taken into account,as does the scale of the increase.CONSULTATION must take place with interested parties,whether this is a statutory requirement or not, and results of that consultation must be considered by the council before the decision is made.it is important that any consultation is done fairly and the results considered properly by the council.ANY suggestion that the cosultation is a sham would be grounds for an application for leave to seek a judicial review of the final decision.
the judge in kelly v liverpool said although s53 contains no requirement for consultation, a local authority would be ill-advised not to embark upon some element of consultation with those persons who would be affected by an increase in fees (eg the drivers of BOTH hackney carriages and private hire vehicles).

But you already new that?

So should I object now before the deadline for objections or should I wait for the council to implement the changes and then say something about the lack of consultation?

Author:	wannabeeahack [ Thu Mar 01, 2012 8:31 pm ]
Post subject:	nice of em
LA have written, seems theyve been overcharging since 2009 something to do with not advertising plate and ops licence increases (badge increases dont need to be advertised?) only problem is how the hell do i know the start and finish dates for plates/ops licences? ive got the reciepts the forms for a refund asks for start/finish dates

Author:	brodiedoe [ Sat Mar 03, 2012 8:16 am ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
wannabeeahack wrote: LA have written, seems theyve been overcharging since 2009 something to do with not advertising plate and ops licence increases (badge increases dont need to be advertised?) only problem is how the hell do i know the start and finish dates for plates/ops licences? ive got the reciepts the forms for a refund asks for start/finish dates Wannabee just request under The Freedom of Information Act/ Data protection from your Licensing team a copy of everything held (case sensitive) on your file. This in turn will then give you a copy of all paperwork/dates to then proceed with your refund. This is now what is happening in Fenland and several drivers have already been paid out. All Councils should advertise these increases.

Author:	charles007 [ Sat Mar 03, 2012 10:46 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
yes but could cost £10 for the information as its not a FOI request

Author:	edders23 [ Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:26 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
Our council have kept quiet about it and have started advertising this year

Author:	wannabeeahack [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 3:20 am ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
edders23 wrote: Our council have kept quiet about it and have started advertising this year go and ask when the last advertised fee rises were for vehicle plates and ops licences

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Author:	grandad [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:40 am ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
Should there be any consultation with the trade prior to advertising any increase in fees?

Author:	mancityfan [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 3:10 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
although a council has a statutory power to levy a fee this does not give it an absolutely free hand in relation to the scale of the fee that is levied.the impact of any increase upon the livelihood of those affected has to be taken into account,as does the scale of the increase.CONSULTATION must take place with interested parties,whether this is a statutory requirement or not, and results of that consultation must be considered by the council before the decision is made.it is important that any consultation is done fairly and the results considered properly by the council.ANY suggestion that the cosultation is a sham would be grounds for an application for leave to seek a judicial review of the final decision. the judge in kelly v liverpool said although s53 contains no requirement for consultation, a local authority would be ill-advised not to embark upon some element of consultation with those persons who would be affected by an increase in fees (eg the drivers of BOTH hackney carriages and private hire vehicles). But you already new that?

Author:	Sussex [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 6:55 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
wannabeeahack wrote: LA have written, seems theyve been overcharging since 2009 something to do with not advertising plate and ops licence increases (badge increases dont need to be advertised?) only problem is how the hell do i know the start and finish dates for plates/ops licences? ive got the reciepts the forms for a refund asks for start/finish dates Are they asking you to provide proof of you paying? If so then they really are a shower of sh**.

Author:	Sussex [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 6:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
edders23 wrote: Our council have kept quiet about it and have started advertising this year Ask for copies of the required advertisements, or just the dates of those adverts.

Author:	grandad [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
mancityfan wrote: although a council has a statutory power to levy a fee this does not give it an absolutely free hand in relation to the scale of the fee that is levied.the impact of any increase upon the livelihood of those affected has to be taken into account,as does the scale of the increase.CONSULTATION must take place with interested parties,whether this is a statutory requirement or not, and results of that consultation must be considered by the council before the decision is made.it is important that any consultation is done fairly and the results considered properly by the council.ANY suggestion that the cosultation is a sham would be grounds for an application for leave to seek a judicial review of the final decision. the judge in kelly v liverpool said although s53 contains no requirement for consultation, a local authority would be ill-advised not to embark upon some element of consultation with those persons who would be affected by an increase in fees (eg the drivers of BOTH hackney carriages and private hire vehicles). But you already new that? I thought I knew it. Our council recently advertised new fees in the paper. This was the first that any of us knew about the increases. In fact a few weeks earlier I asked our licensing officer if there were any increases in the pipeline and I was told that there were no plans for any increase. So should I object now before the deadline for objections or should I wait for the council to implement the changes and then say something about the lack of consultation?

Author:	Sussex [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
grandad wrote: So should I object now before the deadline for objections or should I wait for the council to implement the changes and then say something about the lack of consultation? Object now, that holds everything up, and might make them take your concerns about previous increases a bit more seriously.

Author:	mancityfan [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:39 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
Here you are grandad copy this and send it in Local Government (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 1976 – S70 Fees for Hackney Carriages and Private Hire Vehicles. Dear Sir, We wish to OBJECT to the revised scale of fees and charges advertised recently. Our ground for objection is that the fees to be charged by the Council are excessive and unreasonable in the context of the Act We will be submitting a more detailed statement of the grounds for our objection shortly. In the meantime I would be grateful if you could acknowledge receipt of this letter and advise the date of the Council meeting which will consider the Objection and what right of attendance and speaking rights will be available to us. Yours faithfully,

Author:	mancityfan [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
Consult that would be wednesbury principles.they would be ill advised not to consult.I would also put in an enquiry under the Freedom of Information Act 2000.asking a copy of any report submitted by Licensing officers to the Head of Function or any Council body to request authority to implement the most recently revised scale of fees.Also ask them to provide a copy of the financial estimates for the operation of the Taxi Licensing function.Also ask them to provide details of the number of vehicle licences, driver licences and operator licences the Council envisages issuing in the current year.Also ask them to provide a copy of the Subjective Cost Centre(s) Budget(s) for taxi licensing activity showing the estimated costs and income for 2011/12 against each relevant nominal ledger code. Also ask them to supply a copy of the year to date outturn to the last available accounting period and any forecast outturn for the current financial year. that should keep them busy, always remember they are not allowed to make a profit so you have a right to see where your cash is going I would also be interested to have details of any ‘best value’ comparison the council has carried out in respect of its licensing functions and how it compares with the authorities it may have used as a ‘benchmark’ By virtue of the Local Government Act 1999 the authority is required to carry out such comparison.

Author:	mancityfan [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
You may wish to read MANCHESTER CITY COUNCIL [R] –v-KING

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Author:	mancityfan [ Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: nice of em
please feel free to amend ie dates,names ect Licensing of Hackney Carriages and Private Hire Vehicles, their drivers and Operators. Local Government (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 1976. Section 70 - Fees and Charges. Enquiry submitted under the Freedom of Information Act 2000. Information requested from the Council to allow Doc G to consider the current scale of fees and charges by reference to the costs chargeable by the Council to the Cost Centre(s) covering the licensing of Taxis. I ask the Council to provide the following information at the earliest opportunity:- a) Please provide a copy of any report submitted by Licensing officers to the Head of Function or any Council body to request authority to implement the most recently revised scale of fees. b) Please provide a copy of the financial estimates for the operation of the Taxi Licensing function for 2011/12 c) Please provide details of the number of vehicle licenses, driver licenses and operator licenses the Council envisages issuing in the current year. d) Please provide a copy of the Job description of each member of staff wholly or partly employed in the carrying out of the vehicle, driver and operator licensing function. For staff not wholly employed on such activity please advise the percentage of time charged to the taxi and non-taxi activity in their job descriptions. e) Please advise details of the staff and management structure in respect of taxi licensing. f) Please advise details of staff costs charged directly to the licensing account NB. I only request details of the posts and the aggregated total annual forecast cost including all Employer’s on-costs. g) Please provide a copy of the Subjective Cost Centre(s) Budget(s) for taxi licensing activity showing the estimated costs and income for 2011/12 against each relevant nominal ledger code. Please also supply a copy of the year to date outturn to the last available accounting period and any forecast outturn for the current financial year. h) Please provide details of how recovery of corporate overhead and any other indirect or apportioned charges are calculated for the Taxi Licensing Subjective cost centre(s). i) Please advise, under the Council’s Constitution and scheme of delegation, which Cabinet member(s) and Officers have responsibility for the determination of the Council’s policies and practice in respect of any matters relating to its powers under the Town Police Clauses Act 1847 and The Local Government (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 1976. Only ask for the info above in stages ie ab@c,when you've got that ask for the others,or get someone else to ask for the other info,if you request to much at once they could try and charge you for the info?