Taxi Driver Online :: View topic - Community Transport Groups

I think Mr Roland of the NPHA has the details of the chap fighting the good fight.

I wish the fella well, cos if he wins our trade will receive an almighty boost.

Sussex wrote:

I think Mr Roland of the NPHA has the details of the chap fighting the good fight.

I wish the fella well, cos if he wins our trade will receive an almighty boost.

There is no fighting them...The Volunteer/Charity transport types have the ear of the government and they are also very appealing to those in government or local government who wish to look trendy and caring whilst saving money at the same time, #-o

Is that in the bus or taxi side?

I know the EU is proposing the abolition of the exemption the UK has for drivers of vehicles over 8 seats to need D/D1 licences, so they'll all have to take the psv test or pack up driving! Simples. They will also abolish the current exemption regarding the use of tachos in said vehicles whatever they're used for.

Author:	roythebus [ Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:30 am ]
Post subject:	Community Transport Groups
I've just stumbled across a headline on the "welcome" page where there's an article expressing concerns about the activities of community transport groups in the Fenland nicking taxi opertors business. This is not restricted to that area, it happens everywhere, including in the bus industry. For years bus operators have been done out of counciltendered contracts by these community transport groups who operate without PSV licences, no opertors licence and without the strict safety checks by VOSA and the licence conditions of legit operators. the same comments can apply to the car side of their operations. A couple of minibus operators are fed up with the situation and have formed a fighting fund to challenge CT operations through the courts. I don't have the details to hand, but the argument is likely to be taken as far as the ECHR. It now appears that CT groups are using government funding contrary to EU Competition Rules which prohibit governments from subsidising businesses. Again I don't have the details to hand of the regulations, but anyone interested could go to the RouteOne bus trade magazine website and go back through a few issues to find out. On another note, Kent County council's trading company, Kent top Temps aka Kent Top Travel which was set up about 8 years ago to operate buses, coaches, taxis and a host of other things, is being run down. After complaints from bus operators, the district auditors have finally found the company is not giving value for money. One of the edicts of KTT was to regulate the prices KCC paid for services by providing such services itself. The only place that subsidy could come from was the taxpayer! I remember reading that they were to start running their own taxis to try to cut the cost of the school transport run. Needless to say they failed miserably and AFAIK they only ran a few cabs in the Medway area. They also "tried" to supply temp staff to all sorts of businesses, including rail replacement bus services. they were so successful at this (haha) that they doen replacement buses one sunday using KTT buses, driven by drivers from a London-based temp agency. Luckily the company is being shut down by KCC!

Author:	Nidge2 [ Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:09 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
There's a guy round here who's spent £18K fighting them.

Author:	Sussex [ Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
I think Mr Roland of the NPHA has the details of the chap fighting the good fight. I wish the fella well, cos if he wins our trade will receive an almighty boost.

Author:	bloodnock [ Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:06 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
Sussex wrote: I think Mr Roland of the NPHA has the details of the chap fighting the good fight. I wish the fella well, cos if he wins our trade will receive an almighty boost. There is no fighting them...The Volunteer/Charity transport types have the ear of the government and they are also very appealing to those in government or local government who wish to look trendy and caring whilst saving money at the same time,

Author:	wannabeeahack [ Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:15 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
bloodnock wrote: Sussex wrote: I think Mr Roland of the NPHA has the details of the chap fighting the good fight. I wish the fella well, cos if he wins our trade will receive an almighty boost. There is no fighting them...The Volunteer/Charity transport types have the ear of the government and they are also very appealing to those in government or local government who wish to look trendy and caring whilst saving money at the same time, our local voluntary group have very nice offices and a job going for a fundraiser ....£35K a year....isnt that perverse...

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Author:	roythebus [ Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:34 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
Maybe the guy on here should get together with the psv industry group; there's no point having a parallel fight going through the courts.

Author:	captain cab [ Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:26 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
Another daft c*nt on a mission

Author:	roythebus [ Sat Jan 19, 2013 10:07 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
I don't think so. The bus side has the backing of an awful lot of bus operators, the trade association, the Confederation of Passenger Transport, and their international counterpart. Many of us in the bus industry have lost an awful lot over the years to the unfair competition, state aided, by CT groups. with huge government subsidies, "unlicenced" unregulated vehicles which need only a standard MoT, drivers running regular bus service, taking fares, competing with commercial services, all with no vocational PCV licence! A lot of us were thinking of re-forming our businesses into CT groups so we could operate outside the psv regulations! Think about the hack/ph side of CT groups; the NHS openly operating taxi services @40p a mile; old folks homes using cars for 40p a mile (as well as minibuses taking their "clients" at £5 a trip to and from their day centres...all doing legitimate operators out of work. Their drivers are often elderly and should not even be on the road judging by the standards of some I've seen; they have no CRB checks, no hire and reward insurance; they moan about "only" getting 40p a mile; their cars and minibuses subject to only the car MoT..do you REALLY want this to continue? CT vehicles should ONLY be used where no other transport is available, yet I've seen a local CT minibus doing weddings, fishing trips and hen nights, all the while the local licenced minibus operators sit idle. Complaints to VOSA fall on deaf ears as they don't have the staff to deal with it. Section 19 minibus permits are given out like confettn by local authorities who don't even make the most basic of checks. Think back about 18 years to the events that brought about the awareness of CT operations: the tragic minibus crash on the M40 which killed about a dozen kids. The outcome? Fit seatbelts to everything. The cause of the crash, a teacher was driving who had done a day's teaching, driven to London for a theatre trip, driven back and supposedly fallen asleep at the wheel. We are still waiting for UK minibus laws to be brought in line with those in the EU, i.e. drivers must have pcv entitlement and all minibuses must be operated as psv's and comply with drivers hours! All this illegality is being supported by the government. good luck to those campaigners to abolish the current CT situation.

Author:	gusmac [ Sat Jan 19, 2013 10:45 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups

Author:	wannabeeahack [ Sat Jan 19, 2013 12:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
wont happen next case!

Author:	roythebus [ Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:04 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
Might well do. the psv campaign is taking the matter to the High Court; EU regs already forbid the government subsidising businesses, and that INCLUDES community transport, especially where annual contract value is over £28k, which is the case for most CT bus services. So far the psv group have raised over £180k to fight their case and more is promised if it has to go to the ECHR.

Author:	wannabeeahack [ Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:17 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
I bet you £20 - to any real charity you care to propose - that in 5 years CT is as big and as strong as ever...

Author:	roythebus [ Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:50 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
Is that in the bus or taxi side? I know the EU is proposing the abolition of the exemption the UK has for drivers of vehicles over 8 seats to need D/D1 licences, so they'll all have to take the psv test or pack up driving! Simples. They will also abolish the current exemption regarding the use of tachos in said vehicles whatever they're used for.

Author:	gusmac [ Sun Jan 20, 2013 4:35 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
Won't matter if you leave the EU.

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Author:	wannabeeahack [ Sun Jan 20, 2013 11:43 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Community Transport Groups
roythebus wrote: Is that in the bus or taxi side? I know the EU is proposing the abolition of the exemption the UK has for drivers of vehicles over 8 seats to need D/D1 licences, so they'll all have to take the psv test or pack up driving! Simples. They will also abolish the current exemption regarding the use of tachos in said vehicles whatever they're used for. wont happen how many will be out of work, how many schools will need a PSV licenced driver for 17 seaters, etc, etc...