Taxi Driver Online

A bit of a strange one this. I’m helping out one of the drivers who has had a complaint made against him regarding overcharging. He was asked for a price for an out of town job, ( the boundary finishes about halfway into the journey) he quoted them £40 (which maybe a couple of pound over, depending on where exactly) they agreed and he took the money and turned his meter off.
The customer has now reported him for overcharging and not using his meter. As far as I am aware, you can quote a price out of area and if agreed, charge that. If a price can’t be agreed, the meter must be used. The LA are now saying he should have used the meter until he reached the boundary and then, with the permission of the customer, turned it off. I think the LA are making it up as they go along. What are your thoughts??. Can someone point me to the legislation on this, I know I’ve read it but can’t seem to find it.

Is it not in the licence conditions?

- The driver of a taxi shall, unless the cost of the journey is regulated by a Licensing Authority fare structure, take steps to ensure that any potential hirer of the taxi is informed prior to the commencement of the hire which shall be deemed to be when the vehicle is put in motion or such other time as may be agreed to by the driver and the potential hirer (a) that the fare is not so regulated and (b) the cost, or the method of calculating the cost, of the proposed journey.

- The driver of a taxi shall ensure that a taximeter fitted in the taxi shall be operated at all times, within the licensed area, in accordance with any detailed requirements imposed by the Licensing Authority.

These are from Glasgow.

I'm guessing your LA has something like the second point and is misapplying it here (IMO). An out-of-town hire isn't regulated by the LA fare structure and is agreed at the start.

Not sure if this is provides the full picture, but this is s. 66(1) of the 1976 Act:


Not the kind of thing that can be taken in with a skim read, but I think the latter part is basically saying that if a fare isn't agreed upfront for out-of-area runs then it's the official council tariff that must be used

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1976/57/part/II

But you're in CWAC??

Had a quick look at your, er, taxi policy document, or whatever it's called, and 2.6(iv) says:


https://www.cheshirewestandchester.gov. ... 024-12.pdf

Which is a bit ambiguous, and could be read against your driver colleague - maybe if it said 'journeys to within the controlled district' then that would imply that the meter didn't have to be used for a cross-border trip (assuming a fare was agreed, obviously).

However, the Act overrides council stuff, so you could argue that there's nothing in the Act saying that a meter has to be engaged for a cross-border run if a price has been agreed

Not sure about any case law, but I'm sure someone on here will know. I think the Curzon case says that the meter has to be engaged even if a discounted fare has been agreed, but hopefully that just applies to in-area runs.

Following on from what SW says, ask the council which part of which act the council is alleging has been breached.

The acts are crystal clear, IMO. If a price is agreed in advance for work going out of town, then that meets the requirements of the acts.

If parliament wanted drivers to put the meter on, for no good reason IMO, whilst in the area, they would have added that to the act.

Another question I would ask the council is what is the point of putting the meter on for out-of-town work when a price has already been agreed.

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IDFIMH

And slightly interesting to compare the wording on the tariff cars in the three CWAC zones:




Wonder why the words 'while hired' have been dropped from the end of the Chester wording? Or maybe the words were added to the other two?

But since it's all a bit ambiguous, why doesn't it specifically say that the taximeter must be engaged for all journeys, whether ending within or outside the zone?

If they want the meter engaged even for out-of-area runs then why not explicitly say so? Drivers aren't lawyers, and the tariff card wording, together with the 1976 Act and the commonly held view in the trade, is normally construed as meaning that the meter needn't be engaged for cross-border runs if a fare has been agreed.

And ask them about the rogue apostrophe on the Ellesmere Port card - if they don't know their apostrophes, they should at least be consistently wrong about it

(Actually, maybe better not to ask them about the last point, which might look a bit smart-ar$ed/nitpicking )

The three tariff cards for the different CWAC zones can be found here:

https://www.cheshirewestandchester.gov. ... nd-charges

Thanks guys, I sort of knew the answer before I asked the question. The enforcement officer is new to the job and I think he’s reading it literally from the fare card as “The taximeter must remain on during all hirings within the hackney Zone.”
When I queried as to to why it needs to stay on until the boundary is reached he replied that the customer might change his mind before the boundary is reached and might want to get out earlier, we then wouldn’t know what to charge, it’s a fair point but I then asked what it if the passenger decided to get out after the boundary was reached, his reply was because it’s out of area it’s not the LA’s concern!!
I think he answered his own question.
I’ll keep you informed of what happens next but I think I know that as well.

Switching off the meter at the boundary makes no sense - for an out-of-town, it's either on or off.

From Glasgow CC website:

It is important to note that journeys outwith the city boundary are not regulated by the Licensing Authority. Taxi Drivers are not obligated to take you to a destination outwith the City. If the driver agrees to a journey outwith the boundary you should agree your fare prior to the journey commencing.

Some drivers may agree a flat fee for the journey others may choose to use their taxi meter to calculate the fare for journey and then add an additional charge - often called a boundary charge - onto the fare. In any event the driver must leave the taxi meter running throughout the journey.

Have to admit the last sentence is news to me. IIRC the Glasgow boundary charge is meter + 1 third, but it's much more usual to agree a flat fare for an out-of-town.

If they persist with the complaint, the best defence might be to re-run the journey with the meter running to prove that £40 was ball-park reasonable.

And/or, argue that £40 was
- agreed
- paid
- not disputed at the time

Any out-of-town fare is not regulated by the LA so can't be an overcharge anyway.

I noticed the errant apostrophe as well. Nit-picking, yes. But that's what legal arguments are all about.

To repeat the stuff Mr XH558 posted earlier:


Not sure if leaving the meter running just refers to when metre plus boundary charge is agreed on. In particular, there should be a full stop after 'journey' and a capital letter before 'Others' (doesn't remind me of anyone on here at all ). Which would arguably clarify the paragraph, and maybe change the meaning slightly to mean that if a flat fee is agreed then the 'metre' doesn't have to be engaged.

And interesting that this is information for passengers, and thus goes against what drivers think is the accepted practice - maybe a former Glasgow member of staff has landed in X-ray's patch

Anyway, if I'd agreed an out-of-area fare that was higher than clock, no way I'd leave the meter running - recipe for a ruck at the other end

Had a look at quite a few tariff cards last night (easy to find with Google). Many don't mention charging for out-of-area runs, but most do. And while the vast majority of those state that a flat fare can be agreed, there's not a scintilla of evidence on any of them to suggest the meter must be engaged if such a fare is agreed.

Oxford City has quite a long explanation, for example, but absolutely zero to suggest that the meter needs to be engaged if a flat fare has been agreed. Of course, licensing authorities can make their own rules, but only as allowed under the legislation. So what evidence is there to suggest CWAC can say drivers need to engage the meter at any time during an agreed cross-border run?

(Also found at least one council which seems to think it can actually regulate the fare for cross-border runs

But I'd guess those are outliers, and wouldn't survive a legal challenge )

This is the relevant part of the Oxford card - a lot more words than the norm, but it does help contextualise it. Full card via the link:


https://www.oxford.gov.uk/taxi-informat ... taxi-fares

I’m not convinced about the ‘punter might get out before you leave town’ argument.

A price/contract has been agreed, if the customer wishes to break that contract then that’s down to them. In my view the contract price still applies unless the driver wishes to voluntarily lower the price.

Now some may say that as the job didn’t leave the area then it must be done at the council set rate, and 9,999 times out of 10,000 I would agree. But this is the odd one out IMO.

My reason is based on what a driver could do if the fare/contract was cancelled before the job was due. In many circumstances the customer could be still liable for the fare, as the driver might have refused other work due to him being committed to this job. Why should he lose out?

So to get to the end of a very long scenario, if the driver is able to claim the full fare without moving an inch he should be able to claim the full fare having completed a large chunk of it.

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IDFIMH

Within the LA I always put the meter on, punters often moaned,I said "its the law, but ill have a punt with you, ill quote a price (out of the area job), do you want the quote or the meter fare? ......roll the dice"

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