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Can a Taxi driver be given a medical exemption from loading and unloading passengers confined to a wheelchair? I have never seen one.

Question Two. Can a proprietor be given a medical exemption from operating a WAV in a district where a mandatory 100% WAV order is in force? Again, I have never seen one.

BTW jimbo, I assume there's no Mandatory Order type thing in Lincoln, ie turning circle and all that?

When the "informal consultation" on implementing the DDA was published about 10 years ago provision was to be made for medical exemptions but I'm sure the proposal was that exempt drivers would still have to run WAVs.

While this of course had never been implemented nationally and thus has no real legal significance, it might be worth mentioning to your LA.

So aren't there other vehicles that all drivers can operate?

He has been granted leave to put on a non WAV only because the feature would be unused, and not as an aid to his disability.

TDO wrote:

So aren't there other vehicles that all drivers can operate?

Sorry, I don't understand this question.

jimbo wrote:

He has been granted leave to put on a non WAV only because the feature would be unused, and not as an aid to his disability.

I'm not sure if you're disagreeing with me re the DDA consultation, but as I said only the driver could be exempted on medical grounds, and not the vehicle.

jimbo wrote:

TDO wrote:

So aren't there other vehicles that all drivers can operate?

Sorry, I don't understand this question.

Unless you mean the E7 variant.

Lincoln is 10% TX 40% Metrocab 50% E7 or similar.

jimbo wrote:

TDO wrote:

So aren't there other vehicles that all drivers can operate?

Sorry, I don't understand this question.

Unless you mean the E7 variant.

Lincoln is 10% TX 40% Metrocab 50% E7 or similar.

Yes, that was what I meant - I didn't realise that Lincoln had Eurotaxis and the like. And why so many Metrocabs?

But the requirements in 3 (iii) don't seem too onerous - I'm not an expert on these matters, but aren't there other vehicles that can meet these requirements, eg converted people carriers like Mr Gusmac's VW Sharan in Aberdeen?

Author:	jimbo [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 1:49 pm ]
Post subject:	WAV to Saloon?
In 1989 (including me) all Hackney Carriage Proprietors in Lincoln got a letter from the City Council telling us that from the !st April 1994, all Hackney Carriages shall be wheelchair accessible, which at the time meant either Metrocab or Fairway, no E7's at that time were being "purpose built" The protest from the trade was half arsed to be honest, and despite some protests, and a threatened Court case, which came to nothing, the condition of licence came into force on 1st April 1994. A few days earlier one owner/driver committed suicide, rather than buy a WAV. Many owners gave up altogether, and on the first day only half the number of taxi's were tested and plated. Two drivers appealed to Magistrates and then a hearing for a judical review, they were allowed to continue for a few months in saloons until they lost their appeal and eventually bought WAV's. The Conditions of Licence state: "The following conditions shall be attached to the grant of a Hackney Carriage Vehicle Licence, and the proprietor(s) shall when making an application for a licence, declare his/her intention to comply with such conditions" 3 (iii) The vehicle shall be capable of carrying a person confined to a wheelchair and have approved anchorages and separate restraints (seat belts) for the passenger. Couldn't be clearer or more consise, could it? So why, at a meeting of the Licensing Committee on the 5th June 2007, were the Committee told by the Licensing Manager that; "Mr X (name witheld by me) a licensed hackney carriage driver and owner, has made a request to change his current vehicle (fairway) and has submitted a list of vehicles from which he would like to choose from. (sic) These vehicles are of the people carrier style. A copy of the list can be seen at Appendix B" "Mr X IS EXEMPT FROM THE REQUIREMENT TO HAVE A VEHICLE EQUIPPED FOR THE CARRIAGE OF WHEELCHAIRS DUE TO HIM HAVING A DISABILITY, WHICH PREVENTS HIM FROM GIVING WHEELCHAIR ASSISTANCE" (my caps) The committee approved the application. Question One. It is true that a medical exemption from carrying guide dogs can be given. Can a Taxi driver be given a medical exemption from loading and unloading passengers confined to a wheelchair? I have never seen one. Question Two. Can a proprietor be given a medical exemption from operating a WAV in a district where a mandatory 100% WAV order is in force? Again, I have never seen one. I wrote to my licensing officer requesting permission to plate a non WAV vehicle under legislation for equality, the Human Rights Act, and due to the unarguable fact that the Conditions of Licence had been re-written. I await a reply. I will go on to insist on a hearing with the licensing committee, and will if neccessary, appeal to to the Magistrates if permission is refused. Strange Days Indeed. Kind Regards, Jimbo.

Author:	JD [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 2:10 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: WAV to Saloon?
jimbo wrote: Can a Taxi driver be given a medical exemption from loading and unloading passengers confined to a wheelchair? I have never seen one. Yes. Quote: Question Two. Can a proprietor be given a medical exemption from operating a WAV in a district where a mandatory 100% WAV order is in force? Again, I have never seen one. The policy of a council is not to be rigidly applied so that it becomes unreasonable. The committee could have chosen the option of denying the vehicle request because even though the driver may be exempt from loading a wheelchair there will be occasions when a wheelchair bound passenger will have with them an able bodied person to undertake the task of the driver. Therefore I doubt any medical certificate on its own would be sufficient to make a council change its wheelchair policy. I suppose you asked the LO why this driver was allowed to purchase a non wheelchair accessible vehicle or is the new vehicle wheelchair accessible? Regards JD

Author:	jimbo [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:01 pm ]
Post subject:
The driver, who has until recently licensed an accessible fairway, told the council that he is disabled, and that his disability is permanent. He told them that as he was unable to load a wheelchair user into a taxi, there was no reason for him to operate an accessible vehicle. The Committee agreed, and he now can licence a People Carrier, such as a Fiat Ulysse. The reasons for allowing this are not known at present. I do not know if he claimed to be unable to get into or out of an accessible Taxi. I have known the applicant for over twenty years. I was unaware that he is disabled, and do not know the nature of his disability. If drivers with a disability such as say, "a bad back" are allowed an opt out from the mandatory requirement to operate a WAV, because of their "disability" I predict an epidemic of "lower back pain" etc.

Author:	TDO [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:13 pm ]
Post subject:
When the "informal consultation" on implementing the DDA was published about 10 years ago provision was to be made for medical exemptions but I'm sure the proposal was that exempt drivers would still have to run WAVs. While this of course had never been implemented nationally and thus has no real legal significance, it might be worth mentioning to your LA.

Author:	jimbo [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:15 pm ]
Post subject:
As I see it, the Council have decided to allow one driver to operate a non WAV for no good reason. He could, and indeed has been able to continue to operate a WAV with no difficulty. He would not have been forced out of business had his application been refused. Which licence comes first, the vehicle licence or the drivers licence? A level playing field is essential. I could halve my operating costs overnight if I too was allowed a non WAV.

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Author:	TDO [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:15 pm ]
Post subject:
BTW jimbo, I assume there's no Mandatory Order type thing in Lincoln, ie turning circle and all that?

Author:	jimbo [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:17 pm ]
Post subject:
TDO wrote: BTW jimbo, I assume there's no Mandatory Order type thing in Lincoln, ie turning circle and all that? No turning circle requirement, just 3(iii) in my original post.

Author:	TDO [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:20 pm ]
Post subject:
So aren't there other vehicles that all drivers can operate?

Author:	jimbo [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:23 pm ]
Post subject:
TDO wrote: When the "informal consultation" on implementing the DDA was published about 10 years ago provision was to be made for medical exemptions but I'm sure the proposal was that exempt drivers would still have to run WAVs. While this of course had never been implemented nationally and thus has no real legal significance, it might be worth mentioning to your LA. This is not a question of discrimination. The driver may well be exempt from carrying a wheelchair user. I repeat that I was unaware. He has been granted leave to put on a non WAV only because the feature would be unused, and not as an aid to his disability.

Author:	jimbo [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:24 pm ]
Post subject:
TDO wrote: So aren't there other vehicles that all drivers can operate? Sorry, I don't understand this question.

Author:	TDO [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:26 pm ]
Post subject:
jimbo wrote: He has been granted leave to put on a non WAV only because the feature would be unused, and not as an aid to his disability. I'm not sure if you're disagreeing with me re the DDA consultation, but as I said only the driver could be exempted on medical grounds, and not the vehicle.

Author:	jimbo [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:28 pm ]
Post subject:
jimbo wrote: TDO wrote: So aren't there other vehicles that all drivers can operate? Sorry, I don't understand this question. Unless you mean the E7 variant. Lincoln is 10% TX 40% Metrocab 50% E7 or similar. This driver can now put up a Fiat Ulysse. What is the difference from a drivers perspective between a Fiat Ulysse and a Fiat Expert?

Author:	jimbo [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:29 pm ]
Post subject:
TDO wrote: jimbo wrote: He has been granted leave to put on a non WAV only because the feature would be unused, and not as an aid to his disability. I'm not sure if you're disagreeing with me re the DDA consultation, but as I said only the driver could be exempted on medical grounds, and not the vehicle. I agree 100% that the driver can be exempt, the vehicle cannot.

Author:	TDO [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:34 pm ]
Post subject:
jimbo wrote: jimbo wrote: TDO wrote: So aren't there other vehicles that all drivers can operate? Sorry, I don't understand this question. Unless you mean the E7 variant. Lincoln is 10% TX 40% Metrocab 50% E7 or similar. Yes, that was what I meant - I didn't realise that Lincoln had Eurotaxis and the like. And why so many Metrocabs? But the requirements in 3 (iii) don't seem too onerous - I'm not an expert on these matters, but aren't there other vehicles that can meet these requirements, eg converted people carriers like Mr Gusmac's VW Sharan in Aberdeen?

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Author:	jimbo [ Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:54 pm ]
Post subject:
TDO wrote: jimbo wrote: jimbo wrote: TDO wrote: So aren't there other vehicles that all drivers can operate? Sorry, I don't understand this question. Unless you mean the E7 variant. Lincoln is 10% TX 40% Metrocab 50% E7 or similar. Yes, that was what I meant - I didn't realise that Lincoln had Eurotaxis and the like. And why so many Metrocabs? But the requirements in 3 (iii) don't seem too onerous - I'm not an expert on these matters, but aren't there other vehicles that can meet these requirements, eg converted people carriers like Mr Gusmac's VW Sharan in Aberdeen? The Council agreed that Mr X cannot load wheelchairs in his taxi. Mr X argued that he therefore does not need to operate an accessible taxi. The Council accepted that, and have allowed him to put on a People Carrier that is NOT accessible, despite 3(iii) "THE VEHICLE SHALL BE CAPABLE OF CARRYING A PERSON CONFINED TO A WHEELCHAIR" Irrespective of wether or not the driver is exempt, the vehicle MUST be accessible.