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Blue is the Colour
http://www.taxi-driver.co.uk/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=8819		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  happy cabs [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 5:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Blue is the Colour
Every weekend in York private hire cars from a certain company rank up in Rougier Street,all claiming to have pre-booked jobs, when you phone the company and ask for a cab they do not ask your name or where you are going they just say go to any of our cars and say your name is blue, or on another day, red, or green, this they claim means that the jobs are pre booked, but if they are all usiong the same name how can this be.
Author:  Sussex [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 6:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Blue is the Colour
happy cabs wrote:
Every weekend in York private hire cars from a certain company rank up in Rougier Street,all claiming to have pre-booked jobs, when you phone the company and ask for a cab they do not ask your name or where you are going they just say go to any of our cars and say your name is blue, or on another day, red, or green, this they claim means that the jobs are pre booked, but if they are all usiong the same name how can this be.

Well best that certain PH company reads the council's operator conditions.

http://www.york.gov.uk/content/45090/31 ... erator.pdf

And best the local council enforce their own rules. :roll: :roll:
Author:  JD [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 7:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Blue is the Colour
happy cabs wrote:
Every weekend in York private hire cars from a certain company rank up in Rougier Street,all claiming to have pre-booked jobs, when you phone the company and ask for a cab they do not ask your name or where you are going they just say go to any of our cars and say your name is blue, or on another day, red, or green, this they claim means that the jobs are pre booked, but if they are all usiong the same name how can this be.


By law a private hire operator has to record details of every hire. Any operator inserting multiple entries of the word "blue" into a detailed log book might be accused of not keeping proper records. Other questions arise which I'm sure someone else might touch upon.

Regards

JD
Author:  Boggins [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 8:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
Where does it say A PH operator has to Record Everthing by law...i dont see that written in any of my LA aggreements....as it happens I do record Details but thats more by good fortune than good Judgement.
Author:  grandad [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 8:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
It is in our rules for PH.
Author:  Sussex [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 8:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
Boggins wrote:
Where does it say A PH operator has to Record Everthing by law...i dont see that written in any of my LA aggreements....as it happens I do record Details but thats more by good fortune than good Judgement.

IN England and Wales section 56 of the 1976 act allows councils to ask for whatever details they require to verify and check PH bookings.

York have similar requirements to most councils.
Author:  JD [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 8:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
Boggins wrote:
Where does it say A PH operator has to Record Everthing by law...i dont see that written in any of my LA aggreements....as it happens I do record Details but thats more by good fortune than good Judgement.


1976 act

56 Operators of private hire vehicles (1) For the purposes of this Part of this Act every contract for the hire of a private hire vehicle licensed under this Part of this Act shall be deemed to be made with the operator who accepted the booking for that vehicle whether or not he himself provided the vehicle.

(2) Every person to whom a licence in force under section 55 of this Act has been granted by a district council **shall** keep a record in such form as the council may, by condition attached to the grant of the licence, prescribe and **shall** enter therein, before the commencement of each journey, such particulars of every booking of a private hire vehicle invited or accepted by him, whether by accepting the same from the hirer or by undertaking it at the request of another operator, as the district council may by condition prescribe and shall produce such record on request to any authorised officer of the council or to any constable for inspection.

(3) Every person to whom a licence in force under section 55 of this Act has been granted by a district council **shall** keep such records as the council may, by condition attached to the grant of the licence, prescribe of the particulars of any private hire vehicle operated by him and **shall** produce the same on request to any authorised officer of the council or to any constable for inspection.

(4) A person to whom a licence in force under section 5 5 of this Act has been granted by a district council shall produce the licence on request to any authorised officer of the council or any constable for inspection.
(5) If any person without reasonable excuse contravenes the provisions of this section, he shall be guilty of an offence.
_______________________________
Author:  Boggins [ Tue Jun 24, 2008 12:03 am ]
Post subject: 
This in England or Scotland???
JD wrote:
Boggins wrote:
Where does it say A PH operator has to Record Everthing by law...i dont see that written in any of my LA aggreements....as it happens I do record Details but thats more by good fortune than good Judgement.


1976 act

56 Operators of private hire vehicles (1) For the purposes of this Part of this Act every contract for the hire of a private hire vehicle licensed under this Part of this Act shall be deemed to be made with the operator who accepted the booking for that vehicle whether or not he himself provided the vehicle.

(2) Every person to whom a licence in force under section 55 of this Act has been granted by a district council **shall** keep a record in such form as the council may, by condition attached to the grant of the licence, prescribe and **shall** enter therein, before the commencement of each journey, such particulars of every booking of a private hire vehicle invited or accepted by him, whether by accepting the same from the hirer or by undertaking it at the request of another operator, as the district council may by condition prescribe and shall produce such record on request to any authorised officer of the council or to any constable for inspection.

(3) Every person to whom a licence in force under section 55 of this Act has been granted by a district council **shall** keep such records as the council may, by condition attached to the grant of the licence, prescribe of the particulars of any private hire vehicle operated by him and **shall** produce the same on request to any authorised officer of the council or to any constable for inspection.

(4) A person to whom a licence in force under section 5 5 of this Act has been granted by a district council shall produce the licence on request to any authorised officer of the council or any constable for inspection.
(5) If any person without reasonable excuse contravenes the provisions of this section, he shall be guilty of an offence.
_______________________________
Author:  Boggins [ Tue Jun 24, 2008 12:11 am ]
Post subject: 
It says *shall* ..but then it adds "That the Council May Prescribe", and to my way of reading that means that its up to the Individual council that they "may" or indeed "may" not Prescribe to the keeping of Records of journeys done....but then again..im no legal Eagle...
Author:  gusmac [ Tue Jun 24, 2008 12:33 am ]
Post subject: 
Boggins wrote:
This in England or Scotland???
JD wrote:
Boggins wrote:
Where does it say A PH operator has to Record Everthing by law...i dont see that written in any of my LA aggreements....as it happens I do record Details but thats more by good fortune than good Judgement.


1976 act

56 Operators of private hire vehicles (1) For the purposes of this Part of this Act every contract for the hire of a private hire vehicle licensed under this Part of this Act shall be deemed to be made with the operator who accepted the booking for that vehicle whether or not he himself provided the vehicle.

(2) Every person to whom a licence in force under section 55 of this Act has been granted by a district council **shall** keep a record in such form as the council may, by condition attached to the grant of the licence, prescribe and **shall** enter therein, before the commencement of each journey, such particulars of every booking of a private hire vehicle invited or accepted by him, whether by accepting the same from the hirer or by undertaking it at the request of another operator, as the district council may by condition prescribe and shall produce such record on request to any authorised officer of the council or to any constable for inspection.

(3) Every person to whom a licence in force under section 55 of this Act has been granted by a district council **shall** keep such records as the council may, by condition attached to the grant of the licence, prescribe of the particulars of any private hire vehicle operated by him and **shall** produce the same on request to any authorised officer of the council or to any constable for inspection.

(4) A person to whom a licence in force under section 5 5 of this Act has been granted by a district council shall produce the licence on request to any authorised officer of the council or any constable for inspection.
(5) If any person without reasonable excuse contravenes the provisions of this section, he shall be guilty of an offence.
_______________________________


England and Wales.
You don't need a licence to take bookings in Scotland at the moment, but that may be about to change......
Author:  JD [ Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:20 am ]
Post subject: 
Boggins wrote:
It says *shall* ..but then it adds "That the Council May Prescribe", and to my way of reading that means that its up to the Individual council that they "may" or indeed "may" not Prescribe to the keeping of Records of journeys done....but then again..im no legal Eagle...


It says shall keep a record. that means you must keep a record and the council "may" prescribe "how" that record is kept by way of conditions.

Regards

JD
Author:  grandad [ Tue Jun 24, 2008 9:12 am ]
Post subject: 
JD wrote:
Boggins wrote:
It says *shall* ..but then it adds "That the Council May Prescribe", and to my way of reading that means that its up to the Individual council that they "may" or indeed "may" not Prescribe to the keeping of Records of journeys done....but then again..im no legal Eagle...


It says shall keep a record. that means you must keep a record and the council "may" prescribe "how" that record is kept by way of conditions.

Regards

JD


That's exactly how I interpret it as well.
Author:  Boggins [ Tue Jun 24, 2008 11:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
3) Every person to whom a licence in force under section 55 of this Act has been granted by a district council **shall** keep such records as the council may, by condition attached to the grant of the licence, prescribe of the particulars of any private hire vehicle operated by him and **shall** produce the same on request to any authorised officer of the council or to any constable for inspection.

Its That word "may" again

Maybe those Conditions are not attached By all Councils but rather at the Discretion of the Council???
Author:  JD [ Wed Jun 25, 2008 4:46 am ]
Post subject: 
Boggins wrote:
3) Every person to whom a licence in force under section 55 of this Act has been granted by a district council **shall** keep such records as the council may, by condition attached to the grant of the licence, prescribe of the particulars of any private hire vehicle operated by him and **shall** produce the same on request to any authorised officer of the council or to any constable for inspection.

Its That word "may" again

Maybe those Conditions are not attached By all Councils but rather at the Discretion of the Council???


I think you missed something out don't you?

The section reads as follows.

2) Every person to whom a licence in force under section 55 of this Act has been granted by a district council **shall** keep **a record, in such form** as the council may, by condition attached to the grant of the licence, prescribe.

The passage states that a record must be kept and that the council can if they wish determine in what form that record must be.

The words shall and may have already been defined in legal terms as meaning "shall" is mandatory and "may" is optional.

Therefore in England and Wales and according to case law, "shall" means you must, it is not an option. The only thing that is an option is whether the council decides in what manner the operator enters the particulars of every booking of a private hire vehicle invited or accepted by him, whether by accepting the same from the hirer or by undertaking it at the request of another operator.

However, if you are not in England or Wales then there is every possibility that the 1976 act might be alien to you?

Regards

JD
Author:  chris2705 [ Fri Jun 27, 2008 5:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
we all know which company this is happy cabs they do it every week and its bang out of order they will be caught sooner or later and if york licencing does its job correctly they will revoke there operators licence
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