Taxi Driver Online

At last, we have a response from our illustrious council, and I would really like comment and help on this.

Scenario: Local club, private land, out of area hakneys and local PH (un-booked) all ranking up along a driveway, plying for hire.

The council say:

Therefore they consider that no plying for hire offense is being committed (???!!)

Also:


I believe they are simply wrong, and the fight continues -

any comments very welcome, and especially if anyone knows of a (cheap!) way we could get this to court somehow
If any of you gentlemen wish to avail themselves of the full document, please use the following link:

Chichester District Council Licensing & Enforcement Committee15th September 2008

Did you provide a 'diary' of observations to the council originally?

If so, did the times of your observations bear any relationship to the times of the council's observations?

If you did not provide a diary, I would suggest that may be one way to keep the case open. Observations will need to be conducted over a long period to catch as many transgressions as possible and as detailed as you can possibly make them.

It would appear, from the linked report, that only one visit was made on a Friday evening.

Is anyone (JD?) in a position to say how this can be challenged as being inadequate?

You may get further information from the council with a FOIA request to specify the times that they arrived at and departed from the site, along with other queries that were not answered by that report.

If I am prompted by future posts, I will let you know.

Good luck.

How do the marshalls call up a 'taxi'?

Is it by the mere fact of sticking their hands up and waving cars over, or do they ring a licensed operator who depatches the job in the normal way?

Have licensing officers ever been present at closing times?

I suspect not so how can they tell a committee exactly what happens?

It would also be nice if the goings on could be videoed and put up on here.

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IDFIMH

In answer to your points Sussex:

How do the marshalls call up a 'taxi'?

They don't! - the council are "terminologically inexact", we all rank up.


Is it by the mere fact of sticking their hands up and waving cars over, or do they ring a licensed operator who depatches the job in the normal way?

See above, the world, his brother, and his dog, just turn up and ply for hire (Hack and PH)


Have licensing officers ever been present at closing times?

No!


It would also be nice if the goings on could be videoed and put up on here.

Noted: I will see what we can do.

To Cabbyman:

Did you provide a 'diary' of observations to the council originally?

Yes, and this is ongoing, but there should be no need really, they know exactly what is going on, and are now condoning the ranking and plying for hire of PH and out of area Hacks.


Observations will need to be conducted over a long period to catch as many transgressions as possible and as detailed as you can possibly make them.

Already done and presented, the council do not give a t*ss, please read the report if you are able.

Any idea how we go about our own test purchases, or some other ideas on how to go legal??

How can the licensing officers say in a report what happens when they haven't seen it with their own eyes?

And have you pointed out to them exactly what happens, re the booking procedure? To me it's 100% illegal.

I think the LO is trying to blind the committee with science in realtion to the plying issue, when it looks to me the act of 1976, not 1847, is being breeched 100s of times a night.

In other words, forget the plying bit, concentrate on the booking procedure. Make sure the LOs look into that, both at the venue and the operator's base.

Better still get them to walk up to one of the vehicles waiting, get in, say they want to go to town, and see what happens.

It's what normal licensing officers do.

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IDFIMH

Your problem is that the Hackney side of the trade is complaining about the private hire... what you need is for the public to complain.... if you have a few shillings to spare you might invest in employing a private investor. and to submit his findings... he could do a number of trial purchases.... with a number of different people.... you might even approached trading standards..... they are the people in Sefton that mount such operations regarding both hackney and private hire.... and then prosecute....
You might also like to write to the cheer and members of the licensing committee, informing them of your concerns and the fact that you have notified the licensing office,
you might also like to inform them than in your opinion if anyone was to be hurt or injured as a result of the said practice( which is being ignored by the council's licensing departments) it might well leave them in a position to be sued under the new laws.
http://www.nio.gov.uk/guide_to_the_cmch ... t_07-3.pdf

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Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!

Sussex


They have seen it, and are ok with it seemingly!

Quote:

Sincerely mate, we have, time and time again, they are taking the line now that if we do not like their decision (the council that is) then "take us to court", we do not have the resources, and they know that (they have OUR money to defend their actions)


Believe it or not, I think the LO may actually be onside - it is a VERY conservative council L&E committee that are leading this, with (IMO) cr*p advice from their own legal dept.



The Lo knows that nobody books - seriously, look at section 5 onwards in the doc I linked above. I seriously cannot begin to see what they are playing at.



Can we do that?? go down the route of private prosecution perhaps?

I was more thinking of getting the LOs to do it.

If they can't, or wont, then the other avenue would be a member of the press.

Have you tried joining a bigger organisation i.e. NTA/T&G/GMB?

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IDFIMH

Quote:
Better still get them to walk up to one of the vehicles waiting, get in, say they want to go to town, and see what happens.

That is a very risky route to go down oneself

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Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!

Mr T:

Thanks for the PDF - that may ruffle a few feathers!!


Just for the record gentlemen, this reply from the council has been years in its compilation, and in the case of the nightclub, I reiterate (at the point of boring some - especially Sussex!). Out of area Hackneys and local private hire all come to this venue, which is on private land, and join a mixed queue, ranking up with us legal Hacks.

Nobody is pre-booked. Full stop.

The fecking council know this as well - we do not have to prove it is happening, they know, but consider it to be legal, despite our putting all relevant facts in front of them.

Unsurprisingly, it seems they choose to hear the bits they want to hear, and disregard everything else.

I know morally and legally we are in the right - I just do not know what way to properly proceed now, as our complaint to the council seems to have floundered now.

It might be worth a complaint to the ombudsman.

On the grounds that the council are not adhering to their own PH operating requirements.

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IDFIMH

Sussex



He won't - see above

Quote:

If they can't, or wont, then the other avenue would be a member of the press.

I did try that a while ago - but it did not do anything the last time really, unfortunately, but I am prepared to give it another go. I just feel that we need (somehoow) to get a legal viewpoint on this stuff.




The NTA is a no go, as the local TA operates a (VERY) closed shop. The others have been considered, but I think it would be a little mercenary of me to join, and then expect action to be taken from the off after joining - if that makes sense. If there are any reps out there that would consider helping us I will gladly join up.

What else do you have in your area that is privately owned ie. airport

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Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!

Sussex:



That is the crunch - the Council have pontificated, and insist that they are adhering to the law, so would the ombudsman look into the law, or simply listen to the councils case, and do squat??

Unfortunately I think it highly likely that they will do the latter, and will not get involved in what is at heart a legal dispute - even though you, I and many others would see the council is derelict of duty (but hiding behind misinterpretation of the law)

Mr T:



Pretty much all of the huge Goodwood estate (motor racing circuit, horse racing, small air field etc. I would include large supermarkets, hotels etc as well.

If a judgment could be made on the issue I strongly feel a legal precedent may help elsewhere in the country.