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BMC 2.2 litre, in a 69 Austin FX4D . .
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Author:  BloodyYank [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 4:05 pm ]
Post subject:  BMC 2.2 litre, in a 69 Austin FX4D . .
Hello forum members,

I'm a cab driver here in the states, that has purchased an old black cab that is . . .unfamiliar to me, and I could use some help . . .It has lots of issues but I'll start with the starter (start with the starter .. .get it? I mean . . . nevermind)
I bought this from Disneyworld/MGM studios in Fla. who had it on their London set for 12 years, for tourists to have their pictures taken . . .it never ran, while in their pocession, nor was it meant to (I think . . .they weren't real helpful actually). At some point some rocket scientist, decided he wanted to try to get it running, only . . .no ignition key . . . .no big deal he bought a cheapo generic replacement ignition, and replaced the original ignition . . . the original DIESEL ignition. So our Rocket Scientist gets to the part of swapping out wires . . .and replaces this wire, for what looks like might be that wire. . . . hey wait a sec that doesnet make the starter spin, ok RIP OUT that wire, now try this this wire . . . OH SH*T (I mean SH*TE sorry still negotiating the language thing) whats all that SMOKE and FIRE comin from those things I thought were spark plugs??? No sweat our MIT graduate RIPS OUT the resistor to the glow plugs (wait, I gotta call, gotta go .. . .airport ASAP!!! . . . .YEEEAAAAA!!$$$$ :mrgreen: :mrgreen:)
Author:  cabbyman [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 7:38 pm ]
Post subject: 
When I googled 'BMC 2.2' and 'BMC 2.2 forum', quite a long list of sites came up, some of which may be useful to you.

The Haynes workshop manual will be useful if you can find one.

Meantime, although I have no experience, there may be one or two knowledgeable rocket scientists on here who will be along at some time.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.
Author:  MR T [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:39 am ]
Post subject: 
Sorry.... crystal ball has broken.... if you ask straightforward questions.... then... maybe we can give you some help..... :wink:
Author:  BloodyYank [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 3:49 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Sorry.... crystal ball has broken.... if you ask straightforward questions.... then... maybe we can give you some help.....


No, my fault, just wanted to describe everything I've tried to get everyone up to speed, and I gotta fare (Its a nother story, but I have the luxary of waiting at home, for calls . . .gotta hustle when they come in though)

Anyway, to shorten this tale a bit

1. The wiring is straightened out enuf to spin the starter
2. The engine spins quickly with the glow plugs removed . . ., I'm pretty sure its not binding and I prelubed the engine with oil in the cylinders and over the rocker arms before engaging the starter.
3. With the glow plugs in it turns . . .but a little too slow, and gets hot within a minute of turning
4. I replaced all the battery cables with zero gauge cables, replaced the battery, and added a second battery, which was supposed to be the original setup anyway.
5. I took the starter apart, thoroughly cleaned the coils and armature, and emeried the commutator. The commutator was "lifted" (segments pulling free) a condition I'm not familiar with, and have never seen. Both my manuals state the armature has to be replaced. I can't find the armature here. 2 places here where I found the starter, want between $419 and $726 US. In general new starters here run between $75 and $180. If I was wealthy, I'd do that, I'm not, and I've disassembled enuf starters, that I know theres nothing exceptional about this starter . . .I even think I've seen it b4.
6. My online searches, have been fairly thorough . . .or at least time consuming, however pursuing actual links often leads nowhere. The American enthusiasit group (out of New Hampshire), seems fairly dead. The Europeon branch doesn't seem to have many resources, both have high yearly fees (compared to other clubs I've joined) with little technical help. I don't want to leave the impression I haven't done some due diligence . . .sorry nother call, gotta run, I'll be back . .heres a quick link . ..ignote the cancer stuff . . .I do that, but I've always done it . . . The story was sposed to be about the Disney history, but they were rude to the reporter, video is on right side of page

Thanx Tim

http://www.fox4now.com/Global/story.asp?s=10417382
Author:  Doom [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 5:29 am ]
Post subject: 
Hi mate, the car you describe is nearly 40 years old so the cabby who drove one is likely to be 65-75 years old by now, so I don't think there's much chance of finding him here for advice, however, back then the advances didn't happen too often so there's a good chance what was in your cab was still being fitted cabs many years afterwards, so I'd suggest a search for any manuals to later models and indeed Austin car manuals incase the same starter motor was fitted to any of them, I'll look around a bit for some more info for you.


http://www.breakeryard.com/cars/make/Austin/FX4D.aspx

Does it look like this?

http://www.remarkablecars.com/for-sale/ ... 4/cat/1731


If so, iirc little changed up until the early 90's so finding bits shouldn't be too hard as there were plenty of them and once finished had one place to go, scrap.


Another whopper link shortened by admin
These guys may be able to help

http://londontaxi.web-log.nl/londontaxi ... r_lvta.pdf

Just be prepared to import bits for it if you want it original.
Author:  BloodyYank [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 9:41 am ]
Post subject: 
Thanx Doom,
Yes thats my austin. ( I did'nt realize the video was no longer available on my link.) Heres a picture when it was on MGMs movie lot
http://s63.photobucket.com/albums/h153/ ... J9RHFL.jpg
I have the manual you showed and this one http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayI ... K:MEWNX:IT

The taxi association doesn't have any forums (hence my badgering you guys)
That breakeryard link looks awesome . . .gratis, emailing them
I appreciate your taking the time to put all that work in your reply :D :D :D
A couple more questions:
Back in the day there were rebuilders who were able to do alot to old parts. Anyone know of a way to reattach the commutator segments?
There is a "emergency hand crank type nut" on the front pulley of the engine. Shows up in both manuals too, but no mention of handcranks. Was this ever a practical option, I mean anyone hear or see of someone successfully hand cranking one?

Tim

(oh yeah, the starter is Lucas # 256153N, and anyone needs help with any american car parts, glad to help NC, except for the Karma)[/img]
Author:  MR T [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 7:25 pm ]
Post subject: 
You're vehicle is correct.... dropped down door handles.... dooms link is incorrect different model ... the two and a quarter Austen was always a bad starter due to the glow plugs.... always burning out ... if I remember correctly you should also have a fuel fed plug which ignites in your air filter housing.... fills with fuel then goes on fire...
coming back to the starter motor... we used to take the Armature into local machine shop and have it refaced... new set of brushes... and away you go.....
Author:  Chris the Fish [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 9:24 pm ]
Post subject: 
It is true - Two Countries seperated by lack of a common language!
Author:  BloodyYank [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:08 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
we used to take the Armature into local machine shop and have it refaced... new set of brushes...


Yeah . . .same here . . . .the operitive phrase being "used to". They had an ugly beast called a growler, that tested the armature to. Not today . . .not around here anyway.. If rebuilding involves more than takin it apart throwin it in a strip tank, and puttin in new brushes . . .they'r lost. As far as refacing, I've got a lathe .. .the commutator segments are actually pulling loose though, they call it "lifting" in the manual. I assume they'r e soldered, whatever they are is beyond my pay grade . ..but appreciate the response

Quote:
. if I remember correctly you should also have a fuel fed plug which ignites in your air filter housing.... fills with fuel then goes on fire...


:shock: You gotta be sh**in me!!!!!
OH! I get it . . .lets mess with the new guy . . .I got it . . .Good one! . . . you had me goin for a minute :P

(Ha! thats good . . . I gotta remember to use that on some newbie cab driver . . . yeah next one i gotta train . . . "ok now to start a cab its a little different procedure" . ..awesome!)
Author:  grandad [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 8:32 am ]
Post subject: 
[quote="MR T"]if I remember correctly you should also have a fuel fed plug which ignites in your air filter housing.... fills with fuel then goes on fire...
quote]

Isn't that the TX4?
Author:  Baconsdozen [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 10:45 am ]
Post subject: 
MR T wrote:
You're vehicle is correct.... dropped down door handles.... dooms link is incorrect different model ... the two and a quarter Austen was always a bad starter due to the glow plugs.... always burning out ... if I remember correctly you should also have a fuel fed plug which ignites in your air filter housing.... fills with fuel then goes on fire...
coming back to the starter motor... we used to take the Armature into local machine shop and have it refaced... new set of brushes... and away you go.....

I have worked on old boat engines.A lot used a system that ignited fuel in a small canister with a glow plug in it,fitted in the inlet mainfold (Perkins and BMC used the system) and we often used a blow torch played into the manifold to start diesels in sub zero weather.One of the tricks I saw used was a tissue wetted with diesel placed in the air filter housing and ignited as the engine was turned on the starter.
Incidentally one of the old guys I worked with would throw any can of "easystart" he found in the bin,saying it glazed the bores and encouraged wear as a result he claimed the engines became addicted to the use of the fluid and would get to the stage they wouldnt start without it.
Author:  BloodyYank [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:40 am ]
Post subject: 
Ok . . . .c'mon guys . . . funs over ... .your just tryin to scare me, now ..
Author:  BloodyYank [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 12:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Incidentally one of the old guys I worked with would throw any can of "easystart" he found in the bin,saying it glazed the bores and encouraged wear as a result he claimed the engines became addicted to the use of the fluid and would get to the stage they wouldnt start without it.

I know from startin some diesel trucks, they make this gawd awful knock like you threw a rod . . . but for this first start I'll probably have to, got some smoke comin out the exhaust, b4 I gave up and pulled the starter, using that stuff . . .we call it "ether" don't know if thats whats in it or not ...

I think I may have found some salvation . ..maybe . ..but its lookin good:
http://www.woodauto.com/Unit.aspx?Man=LUCAS&Ref=26153

found this cute little puppy whilst I was roamin the net . . .made me grin, I've had a couple spitfires, so I could relate
http://www.mez.co.uk/lucas.html
and this (transcends all races of gearheads):
http://www.mez.co.uk/haynes.html
Author:  blackpool [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 4:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
easystart those were the days still use it now and again !!
Author:  MR T [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:30 pm ]
Post subject: 
The phrase addicted to easy start came from people who were too tight-fisted to correct the starting problem..... clean the injectors and new heater plugs... and then throw away the can.... unless the engine was completely knackered.

And that looks spot-on http://www.woodauto.com/Unit.aspx?Man=LUCAS&Ref=26153

if you have got white smoke... just give it a tow in gear... or is it automatic.
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