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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 12:54 am 
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Skull wrote:
Come on Gusmac, you have to admit. You've out done yourself this time, MR Manifesto. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Do you know anyone who's read a political manifesto?

BTW that bus with the wire windows is for you.......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WmbbFD_XhQ

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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 12:59 am 
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Gusmac Writes:
Quote:
Do you know anyone who's read a political manifesto?


So how do you know what the fu*k, you are voting for, you fu*king muppet? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I've read it, and I'm not voting SNP. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:03 am 
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Skull wrote:
Gusmac Writes:
Quote:
Do you know anyone who's read a political manifesto?


So how do you know what the fu*k, you are voting for, you fu*king muppet? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I've read it, and I'm not voting SNP. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


I haven't read it and I'm not voting SNP either. :p

BTW your not voting for anything, your agitating for [edited by admin] knows what. :badgrin:

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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:07 am 
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gusmac wrote:
Skull wrote:
Gusmac Writes:
Quote:
Do you know anyone who's read a political manifesto?


So how do you know what the fu*k, you are voting for, you fu*king muppet? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I've read it, and I'm not voting SNP. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


I haven't read it and I'm not voting SNP either. :p

BTW your not voting for anything, your agitating for [edited by admin] knows what. :badgrin:


Gusmac, we are on the same side. I would vote SNP/Independence, tomorrow, if that manifesto meant the people of Scotland came first. The sad truth is, it doesn't, and we don't... :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad:


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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:48 am 
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Skull wrote:

Gusmac, we are on the same side. I would vote SNP/Independence, tomorrow, if that manifesto meant the people of Scotland came first. The sad truth is, it doesn't, and we don't... :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad:


The SNP's manifesto is of little interest to me because I don't vote for them.

I know people from the labour and lib dem parties - card carrying members - who are voting yes in the referendum.
Not through any love for AS or the SNP but because they think it's the best thing for our country.
I dare say a few tories are too but that's just guesswork. I don't know all that many tories.
I even know a couple of SNP people who are voting no, because AS won't commit to their pet policy of a republican Scotland.

Skull, you accuse others of party politics. You're making the same mistake.
Independence is not about Salmond. It's not about the SNP. It's bigger than either of them. Post independence, they'll fade like snow off a dyke on a warm day.
It's not about Bannockburn, Braveheart, tartan, heather, shortbread or Brigadoon.
It's about us as Scots. All of us, and all our futures.

Yes or no, two small words and one big choice.

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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:13 am 
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gusmac wrote:
Skull wrote:

Gusmac, we are on the same side. I would vote SNP/Independence, tomorrow, if that manifesto meant the people of Scotland came first. The sad truth is, it doesn't, and we don't... :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad:


The SNP's manifesto is of little interest to me because I don't vote for them.

I know people from the labour and lib dem parties - card carrying members - who are voting yes in the referendum.
Not through any love for AS or the SNP but because they think it's the best thing for our country.
I dare say a few tories are too but that's just guesswork. I don't know all that many tories.
I even know a couple of SNP people who are voting no, because AS won't commit to their pet policy of a republican Scotland.

Skull, you accuse others of party politics. You're making the same mistake.
Independence is not about Salmond. It's not about the SNP. It's bigger than either of them. Post independence, they'll fade like snow off a dyke on a warm day.
It's not about Bannockburn, Braveheart, tartan, heather, shortbread or Brigadoon.
It's about us as Scots. All of us, and all our futures.

Yes or no, two small words and one big choice.


I can appreciate where you are coming from but trust me, on this, and I am taking from experience. Once you have independence it matters not a jot what political party you vote in. They all do more or less the same job, presenting the public with the illusion of choice. When the truth is, you have no choice. It's business as usual.

However, let's assume we all go, to the polls and vote, YES, for Independence, then what? :-|


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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:57 am 
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Skull wrote:

However, let's assume we all go, to the polls and vote, YES, for Independence, then what? :-|


We get on with the business of running our country instead of having it done for us on commission.

Our old people will continue to be looked after in their later years.
Our kids will continue to get a university education without racking up a mortgage sized debt to start their working lives with.
Our welfare system will not be discriminating against anyone on the grounds of their location or the fact they are under 25.
We won't be sending our young people to fight and die in illegal wars.
We won't be playing host to £300 billion worth of nuclear weapons and we won't be paying penny 1 towards their purchase or upkeep.
We won't be privatising our health service.
I could go on....

Once there are no more English bogeymen to blame, maybe the sheeple as you call them might wake up to the realities of the world.
Who knows, we might even do an Iceland and kick out all the parasites. You never know. 8)

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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 11:52 am 
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gusmac wrote:
Skull wrote:

However, let's assume we all go, to the polls and vote, YES, for Independence, then what? :-|


We get on with the business of running our country instead of having it done for us on commission.

Our old people will continue to be looked after in their later years.
Our kids will continue to get a university education without racking up a mortgage sized debt to start their working lives with.
Our welfare system will not be discriminating against anyone on the grounds of their location or the fact they are under 25.
We won't be sending our young people to fight and die in illegal wars.
We won't be playing host to £300 billion worth of nuclear weapons and we won't be paying penny 1 towards their purchase or upkeep.
We won't be privatising our health service.
I could go on....

Once there are no more English bogeymen to blame, maybe the sheeple as you call them might wake up to the realities of the world.
Who knows, we might even do an Iceland and kick out all the parasites. You never know. 8)



Call me a pessimist, and correct me if I'm wrong, but the reality is, once in power you have another bunch of elected dictators, with no one holding them directly accountable for their actions. It's business as usual, promises, excuses and lies, Machiavellian politics at its best.

The political class has what they want, and so to their wealthy elite but what about the people of Scotland?

These are promises:

Quote:
Our old people will continue to be looked after in their later years.
Our kids will continue to get a university education without racking up a mortgage sized debt to start their working lives with.
Our welfare system will not be discriminating against anyone on the grounds of their location or the fact they are under 25.
We won't be sending our young people to fight and die in illegal wars.
We won't be playing host to £300 billion worth of nuclear weapons and we won't be paying penny 1 towards their purchase or upkeep.
We won't be privatising our health service.
I could go on....



And this is your real hope for the future of:

Quote:
Once there are no more English bogeymen to blame, maybe the sheeple as you call them might wake up to the realities of the world.
Who knows, we might even do an Iceland and kick out all the parasites. You never know.



If things get bad enough the people of Scotland might take control for themselves “and kick out all the parasites.” :-|


Gusmac, it sounds like you don't believe in what you are voting for, but you want the same as me. :shock: :-|


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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 2:51 pm 
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Quote:
Our old people will continue to be looked after in their later years.
Our kids will continue to get a university education without racking up a mortgage sized debt to start their working lives with.
Our welfare system will not be discriminating against anyone on the grounds of their location or the fact they are under 25.
We won't be sending our young people to fight and die in illegal wars.
We won't be playing host to £300 billion worth of nuclear weapons and we won't be paying penny 1 towards their purchase or upkeep.
We won't be privatising our health service.
I could go on....


Not promises skull. This is the will of the Scottish people and it is what we will have, one way or another.

Let's look at the alternative.
Quote:
Our old people will not be looked after by the state and will be left to fend for themselves.
Our kids will get a university education if their parents can afford it or if they are prepared to rack up a mortgage sized debt to start their working lives with.
Our welfare system will be discriminating against claimants on the grounds of their location or the fact they are under 25. Later, there will be no welfare system.
We will continue to send our young people to fight and die in illegal wars.
We will be playing host to £300 billion worth of nuclear weapons and we will be paying an average of £60,000 each for every man woman and child for the privilege.
We will be privatising our health service as is happening down south.


Skull, these things will happen if we remain in the UK. That's a racing certainty. It will happen in our name, even if we don't want it.
Many of them are already taking place, the others will follow. The Tories want them, the libs want their nose in the trough at any price and the pseudo Tories of the labour party have moved so far to the right they too will allow it, the price of being electable in the UK.
Alone they make a damn good reason to leave the UK.

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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 3:11 pm 
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Skull wrote:

And this is your real hope for the future of:

Quote:
Once there are no more English bogeymen to blame, maybe the sheeple as you call them might wake up to the realities of the world.
Who knows, we might even do an Iceland and kick out all the parasites. You never know.



If things get bad enough the people of Scotland might take control for themselves “and kick out all the parasites.” :-|


Gusmac, it sounds like you don't believe in what you are voting for, but you want the same as me. :shock: :-|


What I want personally isn't that far from you. I'm just not prepared to stand back and watch the country become toast to get it.
I also believe it would be easier to achieve here than as part of a right wing UK.
You are relying on the whole of the UK to kick out the parasites, and that's a far more remote prospect.

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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 3:24 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Skull wrote:

And this is your real hope for the future of:

Quote:
Once there are no more English bogeymen to blame, maybe the sheeple as you call them might wake up to the realities of the world.
Who knows, we might even do an Iceland and kick out all the parasites. You never know.



If things get bad enough the people of Scotland might take control for themselves “and kick out all the parasites.” :-|


Gusmac, it sounds like you don't believe in what you are voting for, but you want the same as me. :shock: :-|


What I want personally isn't that far from you. I'm just not prepared to stand back and watch the country become toast to get it.
I also believe it would be easier to achieve here than as part of a right wing UK.
You are relying on the whole of the UK to kick out the parasites, and that's a far more remote prospect.


No fear of the SNP kicking out Parasites as Ecks a collector of all and any wee migrating beasties and he wants to add even more to his Ecolab experimental collection of worldly guff..

Here's the Government of the UK on the Brink of offering us all a referendum on the EU, (which Incidentally the vast majority of people want) and Eck and his numpties telling us he wants to drag us still further into the eurotrash that hardly anyone wants.

The only thing the SNP does with relish is to be overly authorative towards It's own people...he'll have you guys taxed to death.

That man's on a Hiding to nothing... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 3:24 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Skull wrote:

And this is your real hope for the future of:

Quote:
Once there are no more English bogeymen to blame, maybe the sheeple as you call them might wake up to the realities of the world.
Who knows, we might even do an Iceland and kick out all the parasites. You never know.



If things get bad enough the people of Scotland might take control for themselves “and kick out all the parasites.” :-|


Gusmac, it sounds like you don't believe in what you are voting for, but you want the same as me. :shock: :-|


What I want personally isn't that far from you. I'm just not prepared to stand back and watch the country become toast to get it.
I also believe it would be easier to achieve here than as part of a right wing UK.
You are relying on the whole of the UK to kick out the parasites, and that's a far more remote prospect.


I do not disagree with your sentiment but without the correct political mechanism, your vote is based on personal belief, not proof or certainty. The will of the Scottish people is struggling to vote for Independence, let alone anything else. That's why I am such a pessimist. I want representatives and not leaders. I want transparency of Government without having to ask for permission. And I want to see politicians placed under real public scrutiny and made accountable to their electorate.

If they fu*k up or fail to do their job correctly, they are out on their ar*e, never to return. :-|

The Government should live in fear, of the people, and not the other way around.

As I stated before: the only way to change the way the world works, is through education. A revolution comes about when knowledge and personal circumstances collide with changes in the environment, economic collapse is one example.

Personally, I think independence on its own will achieve very little. :-|


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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 6:01 pm 
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bloodnock wrote:

Here's the Government of the UK on the Brink of offering us all a referendum on the EU, (which Incidentally the vast majority of people want)


So speaks the voice of the sheeple.........

Why wait to be offered? It's your right in a democratic society. Get off your knees and demand it.
If it means that much to the populace they would have done so it long ago, not waited for their Lords and Masters to grant it. (Which they haven't done yet BTW and unlikely to do :shock: )

Never mind, all is well with the world, and we are all saved from those awful foreign Johnnies (apart from the english ones, of course) by more promises of jam tomorrow.
Only a complete fool would trust any of that shower o' sh*te. #-o

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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 6:47 pm 
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Skull wrote:

I do not disagree with your sentiment but without the correct political mechanism, your vote is based on personal belief, not proof or certainty. The will of the Scottish people is struggling to vote for Independence, let alone anything else. That's why I am such a pessimist. I want representatives and not leaders. I want transparency of Government without having to ask for permission. And I want to see politicians placed under real public scrutiny and made accountable to their electorate.

If they fu*k up or fail to do their job correctly, they are out on their ar*e, never to return. :-|

The Government should live in fear, of the people, and not the other way around.

As I stated before: the only way to change the way the world works, is through education. A revolution comes about when knowledge and personal circumstances collide with changes in the environment, economic collapse is one example.


I think anyone's views are based partly on personal belief skull, including yours.
That aside, I don't have a problem with what you want. I'd like most of it too but it's not going to happen all at once and probably not in our lifetime.

Quote:
Personally, I think independence on its own will achieve very little. :-|


You may be right, but I see it as a step in the right direction. The first step on a long road.

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 Post subject: Re: Just say no
PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 7:40 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
bloodnock wrote:

Here's the Government of the UK on the Brink of offering us all a referendum on the EU, (which Incidentally the vast majority of people want)


So speaks the voice of the sheeple.........

Why wait to be offered? It's your right in a democratic society. Get off your knees and demand it.
If it means that much to the populace they would have done so it long ago, not waited for their Lords and Masters to grant it. (Which they haven't done yet BTW and unlikely to do :shock: )

Never mind, all is well with the world, and we are all saved from those awful foreign Johnnies (apart from the english ones, of course) by more promises of jam tomorrow.
Only a complete fool would trust any of that shower o' sh*te. #-o


I don't trust them much..but I trust yer Indy lot even less...we'd be even more shepherded by that Autocrat Eck at Holyrood, He's already demonstrating his "could not care less" attitude about about what the people want and what he's going to tell them they're getting.

His Mantra is to Stuff us all, for him Its More Europe, More Eurozone, More Taxation, More Laws to make daily life miserable for all Scots, More Regulation, More Quangoes,..the Only thing we are not going to get more of is Public services, Better Education, Freedom of Choice, a relaxation of Dumbfuk laws , Tax Breaks and a load of other things that would help us go forward.

Scotlands rapidly becoming about the least free and democratic country in the UK...worse still his dopey Disciples cant see it or worse still are actively encouraging it.

Like it or Loathe it but in a Democracy like the UK, A free to use as you like electoral vote is about as good as your ever going to get. :?


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