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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:12 pm 
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Salmond’s darkest day could be yet to come

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The SNP yesterday admitted that it had not yet sought legal advice on the position of an independent Scotland in the European Union.

For years Scotland has been waiting to see when his luck would run out – well, now it has. Alex Salmond: gambler, tipster, political animal and First Minister now has another moniker: author of the country’s first scomnishambles.

Yesterday marked, without doubt, the First Minister’s worst day in office. First, he lost two MSPs. Left-wingers Jean Urquhart and John Finnie announced they were leaving the SNP because of the party’s conversion to Nato. That decision, taken at SNP conference last weekend, has alienated many left-wingers in the party because they see it – rightly – as part of Salmond’s attempts to take the SNP into the moderate, centre ground of Scottish politics.

But the resignation of the two MSPs leaves Salmond, who came to power with a comfortable majority, holding on to power at Holyrood. His original majority of five was weakened with one of MSPs, Tricia Marwick, became Presiding Officer and another, Bill Walker, was suspended amid domestic abuse allegations. The resignation of Urquhart and Finnie leaves Salmond with a majority of just two over his opponents, a majority which could be wiped out in a single by-election.

But that wasn’t the worst of it yesterday.

No sooner had Salmond started to get to grips with the loss of his MSPs than his deputy, Nicola Sturgeon, announced that the Scottish Government had not asked for – nor been given – any legal advice on the position of an independent Scotland in the EU.

This may seem intricate, arcane and not particularly important but it is crucial, not just to Salmond’s standing but to the whole independence debate. He has been under pressure for months to reveal whether he has any legal advice on Scotland’s position in the EU after independence, and what that advice is – if there is any.

Salmond has refused to reveal anything, even though Scotland’s Information Commissioner has ordered him to and a court case was looming with Salmond fighting to keep everything secret.

The background is that the unionists believe an independent Scotland would have to re-apply for EU membership which would mean signing up to a host of obligations that the UK is exempt from including membership of the euro. The SNP has always insisted that Scotland would not have to re-apply, so would not have to join the euro – or anything else.

That was the position, stalemate, until yesterday’s surprise announcement from Sturgeon that the SNP didn’t actually have any legal advice to back up its position.

Not only that, but it then started dawning at Holyrood that Salmond was prepared to go to court and spending tens of thousands of pounds of taxpayers’ keeping absolutely nothing secret but his own lack of information. This was the same Salmond who appeared to argue on television earlier this year that he had, in fact, got legal advice to back up his arguments on the EU. At a stroke, Sturgeon’s statement blew open this whole part of the SNP’s case for independence. What had appeared to be a reasonably strong SNP argument, apparently backed up by legal opinion, immediately looked shady, shaky and insubstantial.

More than that, Salmond looked devious, conniving and prepared to waste taxpayers’ money to cover his own back. No wonder some MSPs started calling him a liar in public and then coined the term ‘scomnishambles’ to describe the SNP’s day.
Today David Cameron was given the chance in the Commons to pile further misery on Salmond’s head, an opportunity he duly availed himself of.

This is important, though, and not just as an excuse to watch the SNP in trouble. The case for an independent Scotland easing its way into the EU without joining the euro is at the centre of the SNP’s case for separation.

It is also important because, if this central pillar seems built on sand, then Scots will start asking about the foundations of the other SNP claims to independence. And, if that happens, the whole edifice might start to crumble.

Scomnishambles? It could be a whole lot more than that.

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/hamish-mac ... t-to-come/

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:23 pm 
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Well they would look at it that way, wouldn't they?

They thought Salmond had advice that backed up their unionist scaremongering.

Biased press and unionist parties wrong again isn't really much of a story. :wink:

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:38 pm 
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gusmac wrote:

Biased press and unionist parties wrong again isn't really much of a story. :wink:


I thought the SNP had obtained legal advice regarding their acceptance into the EU, I thought that was why they were going to legally defend not producing it - the answer appears to be they were telling lies.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:50 pm 
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captain cab wrote:
gusmac wrote:

Biased press and unionist parties wrong again isn't really much of a story. :wink:


I thought the SNP had obtained legal advice regarding their acceptance into the EU, I thought that was why they were going to legally defend not producing it - the answer appears to be they were telling lies.


Well you were wrong then. :D

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:00 pm 
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gusmac wrote:

Well you were wrong then. :D


Obviously - but the idea was put in there from someone -

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:05 pm 
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captain cab wrote:
gusmac wrote:

Well you were wrong then. :D


Obviously - but the idea was put in there from someone -


Salmond just quoted the ministerial code and neither confirmed nor denied anything. The assumptions all came from the unionists and their lackeys in the press.

That said, he did nothing to stop them jumping to their conclusions. Now that was a bit naughty :lol:

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:20 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
captain cab wrote:
gusmac wrote:

Well you were wrong then. :D


Obviously - but the idea was put in there from someone -


Salmond just quoted the ministerial code and neither confirmed nor denied anything. The assumptions all came from the unionists and their lackeys in the press.

That said, he did nothing to stop them jumping to their conclusions. Now that was a bit naughty :lol:



Salmond is a facist tirant bastard in the making and is much much worse than Hitler or Saddam Hussian. He's only in it for one thing and that's him him him.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:23 pm 
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Nidge2 wrote:


Salmond is a facist tirant bastard in the making and is much much worse than Hitler or Saddam Hussian. He's only in it for one thing and that's him him him.


Did you hear that at your BNP meeting?

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:24 pm 
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captain cab wrote:
Salmond’s darkest day could be yet to come

Image
The SNP yesterday admitted that it had not yet sought legal advice on the position of an independent Scotland in the European Union.

For years Scotland has been waiting to see when his luck would run out – well, now it has. Alex Salmond: gambler, tipster, political animal and First Minister now has another moniker: author of the country’s first scomnishambles.

Yesterday marked, without doubt, the First Minister’s worst day in office. First, he lost two MSPs. Left-wingers Jean Urquhart and John Finnie announced they were leaving the SNP because of the party’s conversion to Nato. That decision, taken at SNP conference last weekend, has alienated many left-wingers in the party because they see it – rightly – as part of Salmond’s attempts to take the SNP into the moderate, centre ground of Scottish politics.

But the resignation of the two MSPs leaves Salmond, who came to power with a comfortable majority, holding on to power at Holyrood. His original majority of five was weakened with one of MSPs, Tricia Marwick, became Presiding Officer and another, Bill Walker, was suspended amid domestic abuse allegations. The resignation of Urquhart and Finnie leaves Salmond with a majority of just two over his opponents, a majority which could be wiped out in a single by-election.

But that wasn’t the worst of it yesterday.

No sooner had Salmond started to get to grips with the loss of his MSPs than his deputy, Nicola Sturgeon, announced that the Scottish Government had not asked for – nor been given – any legal advice on the position of an independent Scotland in the EU.

This may seem intricate, arcane and not particularly important but it is crucial, not just to Salmond’s standing but to the whole independence debate. He has been under pressure for months to reveal whether he has any legal advice on Scotland’s position in the EU after independence, and what that advice is – if there is any.

Salmond has refused to reveal anything, even though Scotland’s Information Commissioner has ordered him to and a court case was looming with Salmond fighting to keep everything secret.

The background is that the unionists believe an independent Scotland would have to re-apply for EU membership which would mean signing up to a host of obligations that the UK is exempt from including membership of the euro. The SNP has always insisted that Scotland would not have to re-apply, so would not have to join the euro – or anything else.

That was the position, stalemate, until yesterday’s surprise announcement from Sturgeon that the SNP didn’t actually have any legal advice to back up its position.

Not only that, but it then started dawning at Holyrood that Salmond was prepared to go to court and spending tens of thousands of pounds of taxpayers’ keeping absolutely nothing secret but his own lack of information. This was the same Salmond who appeared to argue on television earlier this year that he had, in fact, got legal advice to back up his arguments on the EU. At a stroke, Sturgeon’s statement blew open this whole part of the SNP’s case for independence. What had appeared to be a reasonably strong SNP argument, apparently backed up by legal opinion, immediately looked shady, shaky and insubstantial.

More than that, Salmond looked devious, conniving and prepared to waste taxpayers’ money to cover his own back. No wonder some MSPs started calling him a liar in public and then coined the term ‘scomnishambles’ to describe the SNP’s day.
Today David Cameron was given the chance in the Commons to pile further misery on Salmond’s head, an opportunity he duly availed himself of.

This is important, though, and not just as an excuse to watch the SNP in trouble. The case for an independent Scotland easing its way into the EU without joining the euro is at the centre of the SNP’s case for separation.

It is also important because, if this central pillar seems built on sand, then Scots will start asking about the foundations of the other SNP claims to independence. And, if that happens, the whole edifice might start to crumble.

Scomnishambles? It could be a whole lot more than that.

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/hamish-mac ... t-to-come/



He wants the army and the money so you've got to be in the association to receive it. NATO doesn't want them anyway.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:25 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Nidge2 wrote:


Salmond is a facist tirant bastard in the making and is much much worse than Hitler or Saddam Hussian. He's only in it for one thing and that's him him him.


Did you hear that at your BNP meeting?



It's true.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:26 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Nidge2 wrote:


Salmond is a facist tirant bastard in the making and is much much worse than Hitler or Saddam Hussian. He's only in it for one thing and that's him him him.


Did you hear that at your BNP meeting?



They should run an English "evict the Jocks" ballot in 2014, just in case the "freedom" ballot fails.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:28 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Nidge2 wrote:


Salmond is a facist tirant bastard in the making and is much much worse than Hitler or Saddam Hussian. He's only in it for one thing and that's him him him.


Did you hear that at your BNP meeting?



Don't forget you owe us money for two of the biggest banks that needed a bail out when the economy crashed ?
Bank of Scotland
Royal Bank of Scotland.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:30 pm 
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Yawn. Ignorant pleb.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:32 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Yawn. Ignorant pleb.



Oh and this, how will Scotland cater for the estimated 30,000 civil service jobs which will be lost when they are transferred to England? There are at least 28,000 civil servants working in Scotland on English and Welsh matters which were moved north of the border during the last 20 years to compensate for the death of industry.

What will happen when Faslane is mothballed and the nuclear fleet moves to Plymouth as the SNP are an anti nuclear party?


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:33 pm 
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Nidge2 wrote:
gusmac wrote:
Yawn. Ignorant pleb.



Oh and this, how will Scotland cater for the estimated 30,000 civil service jobs which will be lost when they are transferred to England? There are at least 28,000 civil servants working in Scotland on English and Welsh matters which were moved north of the border during the last 20 years to compensate for the death of industry.

What will happen when Faslane is mothballed and the nuclear fleet moves to Plymouth as the SNP are an anti nuclear party?


Yawn

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