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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 8:54 am 
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Uber: the smartphone app that is driving London cabbies to distraction

For years, the London licensed cab driver's badge was worn with pride. Up to five gruelling years spent scootering around the capital learning "the knowledge", plus a full medical, meant the black hackney was driven by the cream of drivers. But now there is insurgency on the block. The digital revolution that has changed so many industries is sweeping the taxi business, possibly putting the very future of the famous vehicle so loved by tourists and Londoners alike under threat.

Next month, London's black-taxi drivers are planning a mass protest in the capital against Californian technology company Uber, which is leading the changes in the way people hail cabs. Uber – like several other entrants to the lucrative cab business – allows people to use an application on their phones to see where the closest car is to them and then book it after agreeing a set fare, which is paid by credit card. No cash changes hands, and Uber even discourages passengers from tipping their drivers.

The encroachment of smartphone technology on the capital's taxi operations is being looked at by the licensing authority, Transport for London. In a statement, it said: "We've seen no evidence to suggest that Uber London Ltd are not fit and proper to hold a London private hire operators' licence, but no final decisions have been made while Uber's operating model is still under investigation."

Taxis and minicabs are regulated differently in London. Black cabs, allowed to use bus lanes and to pick up passengers who hail them in the street, are more tightly regulated and their fares are metered. Minicab drivers work under a lighter touch and have fewer privileges, but still must be licensed and registered.

The new cabs being "facilitated" by Uber – which says it is not a cab firm but an enabling "platform" – are, according to the Licensed Taxi Drivers' Association, being allowed to straddle both while only meeting the licensing criteria for minicabs: they are classified as a minicab service but can use a charging system more like metering, even though there isn't a meter inside the car.

London cabbies aren't alone in their protest against technology that undermines their business with just a phone and a satnav. Uber has run into opposition in 15 of the 100 cities worldwide in which it operates – in the UK that includes Manchester. There have been protests and even court cases against it in Brussels, Toronto, Paris, Berlin and New York, plus several other US cities.

Jo Bertram, general manager of Uber in the UK and Ireland, said the service was so popular that the average wait for a cab was around five minutes. "Seven during the tube strike," she added.

She was more coy on how many cars and drivers were registered to its "platform". "Our clients are giving us very encouraging feedback and we're seeing fantastic growth," Bertram said. "The private hire industry hasn't been shaken up in a decade or more. The laws governing it were written in 1988, before smartphones were even invented. All our drivers are independent operators, but clients can rate their driver at the end of a journey, so we make sure the right people are out there and the right price is charged at the end of each journey. "

The idea is very simple – if you want a taxi, you look at the app on your phone, see where the nearest car is and order it. You can then watch the little icon on screen as it approaches. The payment is taken from the registered credit card.

Nicko Williamson runs Bounce, another app-driven taxi firm. "We don't want to put the black cabs out of business. It's an iconic thing. You can hail them, and that's really important for Londoners. Will drivers stop aspiring to be a black cabbie? I don't think that's going to happen any time yet. There's still a demand, but we work on a commission model with our drivers – straight 20%. They can log on and off when they want, and we find loads of people want to be drivers. We have a fixed upfront price and our overheads are lower, without the minicab office and telephone operators.

"A lot of people don't realise how big this market is. There are 65,000 mini cabs in London. But it has been very inefficient. A driver who picks someone up in central London and drops them off out in the sticks is driving back empty. That's wasted mileage, higher pollution, higher congestion and no money earned. The app system allows that cab to be booked immediately by someone in the area."

Passengers can also be sent a photograph of the driver and the car's registration number. The whole journey is recorded on an emailed receipt. But while people can request a fare quote, the journey cost is calculated, says the LTDA, by a metering system even if the meter is not actually inside the car.

London cabbies are plotting their survival. The June protest will attract enough drivers to cause serious congestion in central London, said the LTDA's general secretary, Steve McNamara. "We're not asking for Uber to be banned. If everyone else has to follow the rules, why shouldn't they?"

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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 12:45 pm 
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More free advertising for Uber.

From the public's point of view, it's not going to do the London taxi trade any good, with the intended disruption it is likely to cause.

People who don't already know about it, are curious to see what Uber is all about, download the app and possibly start using it, and will wonder what all the fuss is about.

They're not really bothered about the law - how the fare is calculated - the rates Uber charge are more transparent and easier to work out than London taxi fares, also you're not sure whether or not you can pay by card in one, until you get in one (or unless there are signs outside the cab), and if you do, there could be a surcharge of up to 10%, either that or it's a stop at a cash machine.

Furthermore, Uber fares are rounded down to the nearest pound - I did a journey that would have cost £11.98, and paid £11.00 for it (which was 5 miles at 1am in the morning by the way!).


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 1:06 pm 
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Bring it on i reckon UBER good at putting SPIVS out of business =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>ie LPHCA members :badgrin: :badgrin: :badgrin:

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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 1:59 pm 
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And when the free credits and hype finish, what are you left with?

The usual foreign nationals, poor communication, poor knowledge, and sat navs.

Aye, that's going to affect me. I've just finished the most profitable weekend I can remember and I'm still seeing Ph plotted up half asleep awaiting their masters next instruction.

20% for a job? :lol:


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 2:01 pm 
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trotskys twin wrote:
Bring it on i reckon UBER good at putting SPIVS out of business =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>ie LPHCA members :badgrin: :badgrin: :badgrin:



And if they are the new Addison Lee, it'll be 30% before long.

One bunch if slavemasters replaced by an ISlavemaster


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 3:06 pm 
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GBC wrote:

The usual foreign nationals, poor communication, poor knowledge, and sat navs.



After the journey, you can rate the driver. If the overall rating over time goes below a certain point (something similar to eBay), then they'll get kicked off the system. It looks like Uber got plenty of drivers willing to sign up, they can probably afford to be choosy.

I've used Uber 3 times so far, never had a problem with them (yet). Don't really care where they come from, no need to communicate, the app will find you using GPS, and you can input the destination in the app before the driver arrives (and you'll get an estimate quote as well), or you tell the driver where to go.


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 6:24 pm 
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trotskys twin wrote:
Bring it on i reckon UBER good at putting SPIVS out of business =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>ie LPHCA members :badgrin: :badgrin: :badgrin:

I always thought you was a friend of the spivs.

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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 9:35 pm 
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christopherwk wrote:
GBC wrote:

The usual foreign nationals, poor communication, poor knowledge, and sat navs.



After the journey, you can rate the driver. If the overall rating over time goes below a certain point (something similar to eBay), then they'll get kicked off the system. It looks like Uber got plenty of drivers willing to sign up, they can probably afford to be choosy.

I've used Uber 3 times so far, never had a problem with them (yet). Don't really care where they come from, no need to communicate, the app will find you using GPS, and you can input the destination in the app before the driver arrives (and you'll get an estimate quote as well), or you tell the driver where to go.



Yeah, alright drive, we're going to shakys, drop us there.

Silence.

Yeah we're going to the hotel in paddington, you know the one the old post house forte.

Silence.

We need heathrow, but we don't know what terminal.

Silence.

I'm quite the opposite, I think the ability to speak in English whilst driving a cab in London happens to be quite high on the list of requirements to be licensed. Also the ability for the operator to actually comply with the PH act would be up there too.

Shame TFL and some Minicab firms don't share my view.

Perhaps they will after a JD?


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 11:58 pm 
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GBC wrote:
Silence.



Silence.



Silence.




Those silent drivers will get 1 star ratings and eventually get kicked off the system.

As I said, the ratings system will sort out the good drivers from the bad.

I would imagine most of the public don't even know what the PH act is, and probably don't care. :-|


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 1:49 am 
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I don't think the traveling publics ignorance of the rules we all have to abide by is an excuse for firms to bypass them, no matter how famous their backers are.

Comply with the law like everyone else, or take their silicone valley investment and go back to the land of war mongers.

Several countries and cities have told them to take a hike, I'm betting they'll be complying sooner than later.

Even the other Minicab firms are in on the legal action.


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 1:51 am 
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And ubers good for the Minicab drivers?

£50 to Gatwick from Wandsworth etc.

2/3 hours traveling for fifty quid minus 20%?

Fook that, slave wages.


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 1:29 pm 
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Hmm, see what happens I suppose, something might be done after the demo.

They seem to get by, my journey from Twickenham to Chiswick (he was in East Sheen heading in when I requested him), he would have got £8.80, and seemed happy. Asked if my journey was worth his while, and he said yes.

Most PH firms have to offer low fixed rates to the airport to compete, as these journeys tend to be longest, and it appears drivers don't seem to mind the lower rates. :?


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 3:36 pm 
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Twickenham to Chiswick for £9? That's a bus fare.

No wonder 30% never renew their permit. I'd be receiving about £25 for that job.


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