Taxi Driver Online

I think a ticket agent is a nearer analogy do ticket agents pay the VAT for the promoter ? or just on their commission ?

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lack of modern legislation is the iceberg sinking the titanic of the transport sector

Any VAT registered person only pays to HMRC the difference between the vat they charge on sales and the vat deducted from purchases. But the vat charged to the punter is always on the price of whatever they sell.

They buy a ticket from the promoter for £10, they pay the promoter £12 including VAT. They sell for £20 plus VAT is £24. The vat they pay to HMRC is £2. Simples. If, like me, they're into zero rated supplies like public transport hiring a bus with driver, I reclaim the vat on all purchases connected with the business and the punter pays the price I ask, no VAT. Net result the vat man pays me every quarter.

Zero rated public transport is for vehicles with more than 12 seats if I remember correctly, so Uber and the likes cannot apply the zero rate to their "sales". The driver, if he is the one the booking is made with, is probably not registered as he is below the vat threshold of £88k or whatever it is so cannot claim any vat back from his purchases like fuel. He has to pass on all those costs in the fare he charges. So if this case goes against Uber, the driver will be the one who is worse off and the punter still won't get his vat receipt unless the driver is employed by Uber or Uber collect the money for the driver.

Uber is the private hire operator who accepts and records the booking under the legislation applicable to England and Wales,the private hire vehicle driver cannot accept a booking or record a booking unless he is the holder of a individual private hire operator license in his name.

If Uber drivers paid Uber a fixed weekly sum, or even a variable weekly sum, and Uber took no cut of the money drivers received from a job, then Uber would not have to worry about VAT on the fares.

As soon as Uber take a cut of the fare then they are liable for VAT on that fare. Not just VAT on the cut, but VAT on 100% of the fare.

There are a number of judgments in the TDO Court Database that confirm the above.

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IDFIMH

Because the people backing it love the idea, and have taken their eye of the financial side.

The article from the leading economist in the USA is simply damming for us TDO anoraks.

In short every Uber job is being subsidised.

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=30404

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IDFIMH

The devil will be in the detail. I would think that the money received from the driver is called something like administration charge. It also make a difference if they are acting as an agent or a principle.

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Grandad,

The money is not received from the driver,it is taken from the fare paid to Uber who then pays a commission to the driver for carrying out Ubers booking

Do you have many dealings with VAT and the Vatman?

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Grandad,

Why do you need help....

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Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!

But the driver doesn't receive the money direct from the punter, it goes to Uber first.

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IDFIMH

And then there is unearned interest while that money is in UBER's account....Worldwide

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Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!

That is irrelevant. If a customer pays by card does the receiving company have to account for the VAT? They are collecting the money on behalf of the driver the same as a base would do if the customer came into the office and paid in advance. It is in the VAT notice regarding taxis and private hire.

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Grandad,

It's not irrelevant, it's case law.

Uber have been deemed to be the contractor, the driver is deemed to be the worker by the Employment Tribunal (subject to appeal).

They are not collecting money on behalf of the worker, they are collecting money on behalf of themselves.

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IDFIMH

Regardless, ANY business that collects money in excess of the VAT threshold has to be registered for and account for VAT, except for money deposited with banks and the likes.

Edited to add that whatever way you look at it, Uber is liable to pay VAT on their "services". even if they keep 1% commission on every job, that puts them well over the UK VAT threshold. they are offering a "service" not only to the punter but the driver as well, and "services" attract VAT at the standard rate. What they may claim back in purchases is immaterial, but usually the more the merrier. It's only if the end service provided is zero rated (like passenger travel more than 12 seats or whatever it is) that the vAT registered person or company will get a refund from HMRC.

How do you see this scenario then.
1. A hackney only company acting as an agent for several drivers takes bookings on their behalf. The customers all pay cash to the drivers, nome of whom have a large enough turnover to be VAT registered. does anyone have to account for vat on the fares?
2. the same Hackney only company acting as agent for the same drivers but this time the customers want to pay in advance using a credit/debit card collected at the point of booking by the office. The driver still receives 100% of the fare. Does anyone have to account for VAT on the fares?

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Grandad,