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 Post subject: self employed furlough
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2021 9:48 am 
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An interesting thing being talked about here.
Some self employed owner/drivers are saying that they have done very well out this pandemic because they have received a Council grant and SEISS payments and they have also been claiming furlough. Now I can't see how they could have been claiming furlough without being registered as an employer and actually employing themselves. However these chaps are insistent that this is what they have done.
Now I can't remember the details that I had to put on the initial claim for furlough for our employees but I am sure that I had to put down our employer reference number but I could be wrong.
So if we assume that these people are telling the truth and they have been claiming both what is the likely outcome.
1, what are the chances that they will be caught?
2, if caught will they have to repay the money?
3, will they be likely looking at loosing their license?
4, could they be looking at jail time?

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:24 am 
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grandad wrote:
An interesting thing being talked about here.
Some self employed owner/drivers are saying that they have done very well out this pandemic because they have received a Council grant and SEISS payments and they have also been claiming furlough. Now I can't see how they could have been claiming furlough without being registered as an employer and actually employing themselves. However these chaps are insistent that this is what they have done.
Now I can't remember the details that I had to put on the initial claim for furlough for our employees but I am sure that I had to put down our employer reference number but I could be wrong.
So if we assume that these people are telling the truth and they have been claiming both what is the likely outcome.
1, what are the chances that they will be caught?
2, if caught will they have to repay the money?
3, will they be likely looking at loosing their license?
4, could they be looking at jail time?



Such is the scale of Furlough scams by some less than scrupulous and downnright dishonest employers I reckon that it is all to much for the government body charged with policing it to catch or prosecute offenders.

I hope I'm wrong but these blood sucking leeches stealing from the public purse will more than likely get away with it scot free, I'm sure we have all heard of rumours and stories of unsubstantiated furlough abuse within our local areas..but you can't act on hearsay.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:07 pm 
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Location: Stamford Britains prettiest town till SKDC ruined it
Surely if you are registered as self employed you cannot claim furlough and seiss as that would flag up when the application was checked

The inland revenue will have you registered as one or the other UNLESS they are self employed as a taxi driver and have another job in which they are employed and I suspect one would disqualify the other


I suspect these drivers are telling porkies or their other halves have been on furlough as well so are talking about Joint income :wink:

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:40 pm 
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Agree with Bloodnock and Edders.

Sounds like blowhards and bull$hitters.

On the other hand, not something I've really thought about it, but a quick look suggests that it is possible to claim furlough and SEISS.

Remember, to claim SEISS, self-employment income has to amount to more than 50% of your total taxable income.

So, presumably, if your self-employed income was £15k and your PAYE income was £12k then you could claim SEISS and furlough?

But I'm assuming that would mean two properly separate jobs, and not just taxi driving. So maybe a part-time office or factory job on PAYE, and also self-employed taxi driver earnings?

Only other thing I could maybe think of would be an office proprietor maybe employed by the office in some capacity (director, manager, or controller, most obviously) which is set up as a limited company. They could maybe also earn as a self-employed taxi driver.

But if they're just a bog standard grass roots full-time driver like me then to claim both SEISS and furlough they'd probably have to be perpetrating a fairly sophisticated fraud.

When you claim these things they'll be checked against your tax records via your UTR and NI numbers.

I wouldn't just assume they're bull$hitting or claiming fraudulently, though, but you'd need to know more about their precise circumstances.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:06 pm 
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The criteria for making grant claims explained that you could not claim some grants if you had received other grants.
HMRC have already stated that that all claims will be investigated for fraud, that is why grants received have to be included in books and tax returns.
They know it will possibly take years to look at them all but they intend to reclaim overpayments in which case prosecution for fraudulent claims would be the outcome.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:25 pm 
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For S/E the SEISS and ARG grants could easily exceed £17,000 - so £5000 over the £12K personal tax allowances PLUS ant income from work, and agreed NOT not to cease trading after the grants..

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