Taxi Driver Online

UK cab trade debate and advice
It is currently Mon Apr 27, 2026 9:04 am

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 124 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2003 7:25 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2003 6:09 pm
Posts: 1180
Location: Miles away from paradise, not far from hell.
But lets be honest, how many of us would turn down the chance of getting an extra ton or two a week?

If the driver doesn't want to give it, he/she can please themselves.

Alex

_________________
ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

Simply the best taxi forum in the whole wide world. www.taxi-driver.co.uk


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2003 9:57 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2003 12:04 am
Posts: 725
Location: Essex, England
Sussex Man wrote:
Andy7 wrote:
So, a jockey CAN give an owner between £100 and £300 a week?

Well thats hardly "earning" the owner that much is it.

Insurance (typically) £50 a week.
Circuit rent (typically) £85 a week.
Hire Purchase (typically) £100 a week.
Maintenance (typically) £30 a week.

Then, of course, there is fuel to consider.....


But why should it be down to the journeyman to subsidies all this?

Many get by without journeymen, most of the hundred odd thousand PH vehicles in the country get by without them, and have much the same outgoings (bar WAV only areas) as the HC trade.

If a driver gives £10,000 a year to an owner, then that easily pays for the vehicle, insurance and maintenance costs. Most on fixed deals pay for their own fuel.

I'm starting to wonder exactly what some HC owners want from the trade in restricted areas. They have a nice little quota cartel, and a car paid for, insured and maintained by someone else. :? :? :?


So, journeymen should be unemloyed? And subsidised by the rest of us?
I cannot see the logic here. I just have not met many journeymen who actually want to be owner drivers, and I have not met any rich owner drivers who employ journeymen.

About 7 months ago, our circuit went from all fleet rental cars to whatever the drivers wanted. They could just take over their cars as owner drivers (no premium fior the plate), become employed on PAYE or stay as they were as journeymen sharing cars. Of 50 drivers, only 5 actually wanted to change.

Now, 7 months later, the margins created by either fleet cars of owner drivers, is just fractionally better earnings for the owner drivers, mainly due to the fact that they do not have to account for VAT on their fares. The profitability of the cars with journeymen is also only marginal. These Fat Cat owners, are just something I have heard the T&G complain about, but are something I have never actually seen. And I have been in and out of the trade in several towns, over about 30 years.

Maybe in the big cities it is different, I dont know. But in both our delimited town, AND the limited towns I have worked in, the margins on operating taxis have never been so great that one can get rich from it with or without journeymen.

My personal view, is that the debate on journeymen/not using or being a journeymen, is simply devisive ideological talk which serves no purpose.

Other's experiences may differ, but thats my personal experience. Personally I dont have a journeyman, as my cab is also my personal car. But I cannot condemn out of hand, those who do. At the end of the day its free choice for all, and those who say most about it are usually the greedy ones who want it all for themselves, and the same people who try and retain limits on plates. And that, is why I am surprised by the comments of some specific corespondants on here, as I know that really, deep down, they are only after fair play for all.

_________________
There is Significant Unmet Demand for my Opinion.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 3:15 am 
Andy7 wrote:
These Fat Cat owners, are just something I have heard the T&G complain about.


I think you will find that the T&G would promote anything to their members which would see their business become more profitable Andy.

The FAT CAT owners the T&G have had problems with are the larger P/H operators who look to impose greater financial burden on their drivers without offering anything in the way of better working conditions or incresed profits.

I'm not at all surprised that the vast majority of drivers on your circuit decided not to change their working practices, as everywhere else journeymen prefer to be journeymen, plateholders want reliable journeymen to look after their vehicles and in most cases each have a mutual respect for the other.


Top
  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 6:19 am 
Sussex Man wrote:
Andy7 wrote:
So, a jockey CAN give an owner between £100 and £300 a week?

Well thats hardly "earning" the owner that much is it.

Insurance (typically) £50 a week.
Circuit rent (typically) £85 a week.
Hire Purchase (typically) £100 a week.
Maintenance (typically) £30 a week.

Then, of course, there is fuel to consider.....


But why should it be down to the journeyman to subsidies all this?

Many get by without journeymen, most of the hundred odd thousand PH vehicles in the country get by without them, and have much the same outgoings (bar WAV only areas) as the HC trade.

If a driver gives £10,000 a year to an owner, then that easily pays for the vehicle, insurance and maintenance costs. Most on fixed deals pay for their own fuel.

I'm starting to wonder exactly what some HC owners want from the trade in restricted areas. They have a nice little quota cartel, and a car paid for, insured and maintained by someone else. :? :? :?


dont know vwhat itsa like in restricted areas Sussex as I am not in one,

Arithmatic is [edited by admin] poor of yours

but I aggree with Andy 7 you have a cosy view of life, but then dont most lawyers?


Top
  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 9:38 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57334
Location: 1066 Country
Andy7 wrote:
So, journeymen should be unemloyed? And subsidised by the rest of us?
I cannot see the logic here. I just have not met many journeymen who actually want to be owner drivers, and I have not met any rich owner drivers who employ journeymen.


Of course not, but we don't want to send them up the chimneys either.

The huge difference in your manor Andy7, is that drivers have a choice to either jockey a HC, or run their own without having to buy one on the black market.

If you have a look at the DfT HC/PH driver and vehicle numbers, you will see that in some areas the ratio between drivers and vehicles is up to 5 to 1.

When you have this amount of drivers trying to get work, the owners have immense power and can dictate what they want. Some have 3 or 4 drivers on.

Now if you need 3 or 4 drivers to make it pay, you either run a Bentley, or you are a greedy c***.

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 9:39 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57334
Location: 1066 Country
Anonymous wrote:
Andy7 wrote:

The FAT CAT owners the T&G have had problems with are the larger P/H operators who look to impose greater financial burden on their drivers without offering anything in the way of better working conditions or incresed profits.


And if the taxi trade was de-limited, those drivers could tell those fat cats where they can stick their radio.

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 9:40 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57334
Location: 1066 Country
Anonymous wrote:
dont know vwhat itsa like in restricted areas Sussex as I am not in one,

Arithmatic is [edited by admin] poor of yours

but I aggree with Andy 7 you have a cosy view of life, but then dont most lawyers?


As you say, you don't know.

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:34 am 
Sussex Man wrote:
If you have a look at the DfT HC/PH driver and vehicle numbers, you will see that in some areas the ratio between drivers and vehicles is up to 5 to 1.

When you have this amount of drivers trying to get work, the owners have immense power and can dictate what they want. Some have 3 or 4 drivers on.

Now if you need 3 or 4 drivers to make it pay, you either run a Bentley, or you are a greedy c***.



Where exactly do plateholders have 3 or 4 drivers on each cab then SM cause I can tell you that in my area journeymen either take the opposite shift to the owner or hire the plate on a 24hour basis. I don't think your telling the whole truth,or evidence that reflects accross a single county never mind the whole country.


Top
  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 5:00 pm 
Anonymous wrote:
Sussex Man wrote:
If you have a look at the DfT HC/PH driver and vehicle numbers, you will see that in some areas the ratio between drivers and vehicles is up to 5 to 1.

When you have this amount of drivers trying to get work, the owners have immense power and can dictate what they want. Some have 3 or 4 drivers on.

Now if you need 3 or 4 drivers to make it pay, you either run a Bentley, or you are a greedy c***.



Where exactly do plateholders have 3 or 4 drivers on each cab then SM cause I can tell you that in my area journeymen either take the opposite shift to the owner or hire the plate on a 24hour basis. I don't think your telling the whole truth,or evidence that reflects accross a single county never mind the whole country.



oh yes can explain those figures quite easily, lots is drop out due to Liverpool time taking, natural nwastage, and people holding on to licences but working in other proffessions.


Top
  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 8:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57334
Location: 1066 Country
Anonymous wrote:
Where exactly do plateholders have 3 or 4 drivers on each cab then SM cause I can tell you that in my area journeymen either take the opposite shift to the owner or hire the plate on a 24hour basis. I don't think your telling the whole truth,or evidence that reflects accross a single county never mind the whole country.


Frankly I don't care if you believe me or not. Facts seldom matter to you.

However if you go to the DfT site, and find the latest stats, you will see that in a large number of areas the ratio of drivers to cars is in excess of 1 to 3/4/5.

So if they don't drive the things, why are they licensed?

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 8:21 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57334
Location: 1066 Country
Anonymous wrote:
oh yes can explain those figures quite easily, lots is drop out due to Liverpool time taking, natural nwastage, and people holding on to licences but working in other proffessions.


Oh, so they do exist. It's just that they don't work, but are happy to pay the council £50+ each year.

Makes sense that one. :?

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 10:55 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2003 6:09 pm
Posts: 1180
Location: Miles away from paradise, not far from hell.
The link with all the stats on is
http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/d ... 508343.pdf

You will see it goes from the ratio of nearly 1 to 1 in London,
to 1 to 4 in Luton,
to 1 to 4.5 in Derwentshire,
to 1 to 6 in Teesdale,
to 1 to 10 in St Helens,
to 1 to 8 in Trafford,
to 1 to 8 in Congleton,
to 1 to 5 in Warrington,
to many more, which I will leave you lot to have a little peep at the rest. :wink:

Alex

_________________
ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

Simply the best taxi forum in the whole wide world. www.taxi-driver.co.uk


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 3:38 am 
Sussex Man wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
oh yes can explain those figures quite easily, lots is drop out due to Liverpool time taking, natural nwastage, and people holding on to licences but working in other proffessions.


Oh, so they do exist. It's just that they don't work, but are happy to pay the council £50+ each year.

Makes sense that one. :?


look for explanations man dont down everything yes drop outs due to liverpool is happening your arithmatic is shady very shady


Top
  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 9:09 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57334
Location: 1066 Country
Anonymous wrote:
look for explanations man dont down everything yes drop outs due to liverpool is happening your arithmatic is shady very shady


It's all very well doing your one sentence of code, but if you have something to say, please put it in plain English.

Or are you saying that the 60,000+ licensed HC drivers, that don't own their own HC vehicle, are not really there? :? :?

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 11:35 am 
Sussex Man wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
look for explanations man dont down everything yes drop outs due to liverpool is happening your arithmatic is shady very shady


It's all very well doing your one sentence of code, but if you have something to say, please put it in plain English.

Or are you saying that the 60,000+ licensed HC drivers, that don't own their own HC vehicle, are not really there? :? :?



of course they are there, but here where each taxi has 3 licenses drivers and has been open for 3 years still the jockeys dont buy!
you bend figures to suit your cause, also many people have duel licenses and let me set you into a secret they dont drive both at the same time.


Top
  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 124 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 95 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group