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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 11:31 pm 
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I agree that Religious Beliefs are aforefront in cases such as these; but surely the driver merely has to tell the passenger this. I have a severe alergy to fur - cats, dogs, rabbits etc and carry a Medical Certificate and LO card to state that I don't have to carry Guide Dogs. I have had this transposed into brail so as a very quick explanation can be given. Given that I drive both an E7 and a standard saloon and I will allow animals to travel in the rear of the E7 and have a similar card that states that all access to the driver has been closed due to allergy.

Back tot he reason that I made this post I think that this driver has got off lightly as he has offered no explanation at all - except a dislike of dogs!


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 12:46 am 
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allo allo wrote:
There are genuine religious considerations here, whether certain readers/posters like it or not. Lets consider the motorcycle helmet laws which allow sikhs to wear their turban rather than have to replace them with helmets,


The practice of not wearing a helmet affects no one but oneself. Refusing to take a disabled person because they have a working dog is discrimination and as such is against the law. By law, the only reason for not carrying a dog, is on medical grounds. I would have thought that was quite clear.

If religious groups wish to change the legislation then they know how to go about it but I would have thought the Government had already taken religion into account when they drafted the legislation.

Regards

JD

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 11:05 am 
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JD wrote:
allo allo wrote:
There are genuine religious considerations here, whether certain readers/posters like it or not. Lets consider the motorcycle helmet laws which allow sikhs to wear their turban rather than have to replace them with helmets,


The practice of not wearing a helmet affects no one but oneself. Refusing to take a disabled person because they have a working dog is discrimination and as such is against the law. By law, the only reason for not carrying a dog, is on medical grounds. I would have thought that was quite clear.

If religious groups wish to change the legislation then they know how to go about it but I would have thought the Government had already taken religion into account when they drafted the legislation.

Regards

JD


As you say, it is quite clear.

My post was simply to alert people who may not have been aware of the situation vis-a-vis muslims and dogs.

A refusal may not be simple bloody-mindedness but adherance to a religious duty that is not recognised in UK law.

As such I can see that a 7 day ban may well be proportionate, rather than inadequate.

Presumably all factors were considered when this was decided.

Turban wearing might affect others:-
I can see a situation where a turban fails to save the life of a motorcyclist where a helmet would have. The other person involved in an accident goes through life with the knowledge of having killed someone. Somewhat more serious than being refused by a taxi for having a guide dog, though I am certainly not advocating that position.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 5:21 pm 
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allo allo wrote:
A refusal may not be simple bloody-mindedness but adherance to a religious duty that is not recognised in UK law.

So religious teachings now negate statute law? :?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 5:57 pm 
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If someones religion prevents them from doing the job properly perhaps they are in the wrong job. :wink:

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 6:04 pm 
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grandad wrote:
If someones religion prevents them from doing the job properly perhaps they are in the wrong job. :wink:


My sentiments exactly, and as for the seven days i personally think that was about right, maybe even a tad on the harsh side :-|

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 6:17 pm 
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grandad wrote:
If someones religion prevents them from doing the job properly perhaps they are in the wrong job. :wink:

Absolutely. Everyone is aware of the DDA.
If a religious teaching means you cannot comply then you should find an occupation in which you can, without flauting the law.
Can a catholic refuse to drive someone to a family planning or abortion clinic? No.
Can a Mormon refuse a fare to the pub? No.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 7:53 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
allo allo wrote:
A refusal may not be simple bloody-mindedness but adherance to a religious duty that is not recognised in UK law.

So religious teachings now negate statute law? :?


No not negate at all, the law is the law but all I am saying is that there are many different reasons why someone may break a law.
Adherence to a religious belief is somewhat more understandable than a refusal because the driver can't be bothered cleaning up dog hairs afterwards.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 7:59 pm 
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grandad wrote:
If someones religion prevents them from doing the job properly perhaps they are in the wrong job. :wink:


It's a good point you make, but maybe not being able to do 0.1% of a job should not be a reason for having to quit entirely.

A seven day loss of earnings would have been a strong penalty to pay.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2007 2:30 am 
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kermit2482 wrote:
grandad wrote:
If someones religion prevents them from doing the job properly perhaps they are in the wrong job. :wink:


My sentiments exactly, and as for the seven days i personally think tht was about right, maybe even a tad on the harsh side :-|


Errrrm just where do you lot operate??? Refusing a fare because of a giude dog should be an AUTO 3 / 6 MONTH BAN! Round here to refuse such a fare you'll be up b4 comittee


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2007 6:57 am 
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Skippy71 wrote:
Errrrm just where do you lot operate??? Refusing a fare because of a giude dog should be an AUTO 3 / 6 MONTH BAN! Round here to refuse such a fare you'll be up b4 comittee

I'm not sure that's quite right for a first time offender. [-X

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2007 7:40 am 
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allo allo wrote:
grandad wrote:
If someones religion prevents them from doing the job properly perhaps they are in the wrong job. :wink:


It's a good point you make, but maybe not being able to do 0.1% of a job should not be a reason for having to quit entirely.


Maybe there should be a question asked when someone applies for their badge regarding this. the licensing officer would then be able to make a decision as to weather the applicant is a "fit and proper person" to be given a badge in the first place.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2007 9:09 am 
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In london you must take assistance dogs, is does not matter what religion you are, the only exemption is a pre defined medical condition.
I bet he worked the seven days anyway, how can a LA enforce a 7 day driving ban?.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 2:44 am 
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rambo wrote:
I bet he worked the seven days anyway, how can a LA enforce a 7 day driving ban?.


By giving his details to the Police and hoping that they caught him working is he were - no insurance for starters!


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 7:52 am 
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grandad wrote:
Maybe there should be a question asked when someone applies for their badge regarding this. the licensing officer would then be able to make a decision as to weather the applicant is a "fit and proper person" to be given a badge in the first place.


I think thats a good idea it would be interesting to explore the finer points of having such a question on a license application form.

Regards

JD

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