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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2023 10:44 am 
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I’m not sure Wardy is saying the act says you must return, his reading of a small part of a sentence in the act is that drivers can not accept work outside of their licensing area.

As I have previously said, if Mr Wardy’s suggestion had any merit I’m certain it would have been argued in the courts over the last 47 years, and even if those arguments led to his view being accepted (in my view no chance) I have no doubt the government would almost immediately change the law.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2023 10:54 am 
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Quote:
Private hire vehicles: sub-contracting
In the Local Government (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 1976, after section 55 insert—
“55ASub-contracting by operators
(1)A person licensed under section 55 who has in a controlled district accepted a booking for a private hire vehicle may arrange for another person to provide a vehicle to carry out the booking if—
(a)the other person is licensed under section 55 in respect of the same controlled district and the sub-contracted booking is accepted in that district;

(b)the other person is licensed under section 55 in respect of another controlled district and the sub-contracted booking is accepted in that district;
(c)the other person is a London PHV operator and the sub-contracted booking is accepted at an operating centre in London; or
(d)the other person accepts the sub-contracted booking in Scotland.
(2)It is immaterial for the purposes of subsection (1) whether or not sub-contracting is permitted by the contract between the person licensed under section 55 who accepted the booking and the person who made the booking.
(3)Where a person licensed under section 55 in respect of a controlled district is also licensed under that section in respect of another controlled district, subsection (1) (so far as relating to paragraph (b) of that subsection) and section 55B(1) and (2) apply as if each licence were held by a separate person.
(4)Where a person licensed under section 55 in respect of a controlled district is also a London PHV operator, subsection (1) (so far as relating to paragraph (c) of that subsection) and section 55B(1) and (2) apply as if the person holding the licence under section 55 and the London PHV operator were separate persons.
(5)Where a person licensed under section 55 in respect of a controlled district also makes provision in the course of a business for the invitation or acceptance of bookings for a private hire car or taxi in Scotland, subsection (1) (so far as relating to paragraph (d) of that subsection) and section 55B(1) and (2) apply as if the person holding the licence under section 55 and the person making the provision in Scotland were separate persons.In this subsection, “private hire car” and “taxi” have the same meaning as in sections 10 to 22 of the Civic Government (Scotland) Act 1982.
(6)In this section, “London PHV operator” and “operating centre” have the same meaning as in the Private Hire Vehicles (London) Act 1998.
55BSub-contracting by operators: criminal liability
(1)In this section—
the first operator” means a person licensed under section 55 who has in a controlled district accepted a booking for a private hire vehicle and then made arrangements for another person to provide a vehicle to carry out the booking in accordance with section 55A(1);
“the second operator” means the person with whom the first operator made the arrangements (and, accordingly, the person who accepted the sub-contracted booking).
(2)The first operator is not to be treated for the purposes of section 46(1)(e) as operating a private hire vehicle by virtue of having invited or accepted the booking.
(3)The first operator is guilty of an offence if—
(a)the second operator is a person mentioned in section 55A(1)(a) or (b),
(b)the second operator contravenes section 46(1)(e) in respect of the sub-contracted booking, and
(c)the first operator knew that the second operator would contravene section 46(1)(e) in respect of the booking.”


My understanding was that this allowed cross border subject to the 3 licenses rule via the subcontract route but doesn't permit PH to work in another district via the operator they are licensed with which may be what wardy is trying to get at ?

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 12:33 pm 
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or as Wolvo puts it.....



Quote:
2.1 The holder of this licence shall not whilst driving or in charge of a private hire
vehicle:
a) Take or agree to take a fare without it being pre-booked via the Operator,
b) stand or ply for hire or solicit on a road or other public place, any person to
hire or to be carried for hire in any private hire vehicle,
c) cause or procure any other persons to tout or solicit on a road or other public
place any person to hire or be carried for hire in any private hire vehicle,
d) accept an offer for the minimum hire of any private hire vehicle while the
holder or that vehicle is on the road or other public place except where such
an offer is first communicated to the holder by a licensed operator or his duly
authorised servant.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 2:43 pm 
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wannabeeahack wrote:
or as Wolvo puts it.....



Quote:
2.1 The holder of this licence shall not whilst driving or in charge of a private hire
vehicle:
a) Take or agree to take a fare without it being pre-booked via the Operator,
b) stand or ply for hire or solicit on a road or other public place, any person to
hire or to be carried for hire in any private hire vehicle,
c) cause or procure any other persons to tout or solicit on a road or other public
place any person to hire or be carried for hire in any private hire vehicle,
d) accept an offer for the minimum hire of any private hire vehicle while the
holder or that vehicle is on the road or other public place except where such
an offer is first communicated to the holder by a licensed operator or his duly
authorised servant.


I take this to mean wolvo p/h cannot park up but must keep on the move.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:53 pm 
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heathcote wrote:
wannabeeahack wrote:
or as Wolvo puts it.....



Quote:
2.1 The holder of this licence shall not whilst driving or in charge of a private hire
vehicle:
a) Take or agree to take a fare without it being pre-booked via the Operator,
b) stand or ply for hire or solicit on a road or other public place, any person to
hire or to be carried for hire in any private hire vehicle,
c) cause or procure any other persons to tout or solicit on a road or other public
place any person to hire or be carried for hire in any private hire vehicle,
d) accept an offer for the minimum hire of any private hire vehicle while the
holder or that vehicle is on the road or other public place except where such
an offer is first communicated to the holder by a licensed operator or his duly
authorised servant.


I take this to mean wolvo p/h cannot park up but must keep on the move.


can park off road

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2023 1:53 pm 
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So what about the owner/operator?


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2023 5:43 pm 
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roythebus wrote:
So what about the owner/operator?

Mr Wardy's view is that it wouldn't matter.

His view is a booking received by a driver outside of their licensing district would be unlawful.

If anything a booking taken by an operator/driver outside of their area would be even more unlawful.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 7:21 pm 
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Wardy, you put a while ago:

Quote

S75 (1)(a) refers to any vehicle, licensed or not, and allows them to drop off in a controlled district. The Act only comes into force if it makes itself available after it drops off.

S75 (2) and also 2A & B allow a licensed vehicle to pick up, drop off or travel through a controlled district (the right to roam), but if it drops off then s75 (1)(a) comes into force.

End Quote

I don't know if you have considered amendments to the '76, but here they are referring to section 75:

--------------------------------------

Textual Amendments

F147
S. 75(1)(b) omitted (28.1.2008) by virtue of Road Safety Act 2006 (c. 49), ss. 53, 61; S.I. 2007/3492, art. 2 and repealed (prosp.) by Road Safety Act 2006 (c. 49), s. 59, Sch. 7(17)

F148
S. 75(1)(cc) inserted by Transport Act 1985 (c. 67, SIF 126), s. 139(2), Sch. 7 para. 17(2)

F149
S. 75(1)(d)(i) repealed by Transport Act 1985 (c. 67, SIF 126), s. 139(2), Sch. 7 para. 17(2)

F150
S. 75(2A) inserted after subsection (2) by Civic Government (Scotland) Act 1982 (c. 45, SIF 81:2), ss. 16, 22, 23

F151
S. 75(2B) inserted (8.6.2004) by 1998 c. 34, ss. 39(1), 40(2), Sch. 1 para. 1 (with s. 29); S.I. 2004/241, art. 2(2)

Modifications etc. (not altering text)

C126
Ss. 72-80 modified (27.11.2009) by The Local Services (Operation by Licensed Hire Cars) Regulations 2009 (S.I. 2009/2863), regs. 1, 4 Table (with reg. 3)

----------------------------

I haven't, but I might, check out Stat Inst 2009/2863, as it altered everything section 72 to 80 inclusive. You should definitely check it as Section 75 means a lot to you.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 7:33 pm 
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Couldn't resist it, so had a look.

Quote from SI 2009/2863

Sections 46(1)(d) and (e), 75(1), 75(2A) and (2B) are omitted.

Section 75(2) is omitted to the extent that it would permit the use of a vehicle in contravention of the condition attached to the special licence by section 12(5)(b) of the 1985 Act.

End Quote

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 10:46 pm 
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Chris the Fish wrote:
Couldn't resist it, so had a look.

Quote from SI 2009/2863

Sections 46(1)(d) and (e), 75(1), 75(2A) and (2B) are omitted.


Thats in relevance to a bus service?

Section 75(2) is omitted to the extent that it would permit the use of a vehicle in contravention of the condition attached to the special licence by section 12(5)(b) of the 1985 Act.

End Quote


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2023 8:14 pm 
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Seems Taxi-Point is promoting the views of Mr Wardy and Co.

https://www.taxi-point.co.uk/post/cross ... overlooked

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