Taxi Driver Online

Not really as local hackneys are only local hackneys on the local streets or local public places.

Those non-local hackneys are not plying on the local streets or local public places.

Therefore which act or section have they breached by waiting on private land?

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IDFIMH

What I would like to see is a copy of the PH ops application form, and a copy of a PH ops license.

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IDFIMH

Sussex



I will provide what you ask for soonest, it being the weekend it is likely to be monday.

I do know that "though shall not ply" is prominant

Shall I scan and post on the forum, or email direct to you?

Sussex said:

Quote:

Those non-local hackneys are not plying on the local streets or local public places.

Therefore which act or section have they breached by waiting on private land?

Thereby hangs the question: they are plying for hire out of district, and are unlicensed, private land or not, are they simply not subject to the law?

In this particular case the old chestnut of is it a "road" etc also applies - there is a scheduled bus route and stop on this land as well.

I know this has been gone over time and time again, have difficulty in understanding how this falls outside of legislation

Sussex

I should also like to ask the following:

When is it ever legal for PH to ply for hire?

I would love to see the legislation, I think I will avail myself of the freedom of information act and ask my LO for the details

Put them up here if you can, save me doing it.

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IDFIMH

But their district only applies to their roads and streets, if you know what I mean.

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IDFIMH

Because of the wording of a 160 year old act.

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IDFIMH

Never, but the issue is how can you be prosecuted for plying for hire in an area which isn't an area where anyone can legally ply for hire?

I wonder how many times folks will have to re-read that sentence?

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IDFIMH

I think I just disappeared up my own backside

Yeah!!!

Right!!!

What are you trying to say, Sir??

A web-link that Mr Sussex would do well to take note of;

Please Take Note Mr Sussex

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Kind regards,

Brummie Cabbie.

Type a message, post your news,
Disagree with other members' views;
But please, do have some decorum,
When debating on the TDO Forum.

Perhaps the point is to ignore where the HC is licensed - the question is, is it illegal to ply for hire on private land, and the answer is NO. The fact that this in effect allows out-of-area HCs to ply just seems to me to be a loophole.

As for the distance from the public highway, perhaps the important point is that even if the queue does snake close to it, it's perhaps instructive that few people are likely to be attracted from the public highway to the cars sitting on private land (I assume) thus to that extent it's difficult to claim that they are exhibiting themselves to the people on the public highway - if it was a railway station close to the public highway with lots of people milling around then that would be different, and I think that was one of the important considerations in the Eastbourne case. Thus distance from the public highway per se isn't the end of the story.

As for touting/soliciting, Doc G seems to agree that the cars are just sitting passively on the 'rank', whereas the offence requires something more pro-active - 'importuning', as our council calls it - thus not much mileage there.

My advice to Doc G would be to pin the council down on the PH cars and ranking up - the report seems to say that both HC and PH are forming a rank, but it studiously avoids the thorny issue of whether the PH are pre-booked. Yet it also states that there's a seperate area for pre-booked PH to wait, which again sidesteps the booking status of PH queueing in the 'rank'.

Thanks for your input Fae Fife

You kindly said:

Quote:

Perhaps the point is to ignore where the HC is licensed - the question is, is it illegal to ply for hire on private land, and the answer is NO. The fact that this in effect allows out-of-area HCs to ply just seems to me to be a loophole.

Agreed - but if they are out of area do they should not be there unless pre-booked AND therefore have to operate under PH restrictions? ie not able to ply for hire?

If so then your comments about local PH ranking up could be relevant to our case.

They most certainly are ranking up, in amongst (very angry) legal local Hacks and out of area hackneys. They are most definitely NOT prebooked in any way, no one is - no who, what, when, where, or how - there cannot be any record because the transactions and negotiations are carried out at the vehicle window whilst they are in the queue.

The council are obviously sidestepping the need to prebook in its entirety - even though we have made the issue plain, and we believe produced legal precedent.

Our council has decided that any Hackney carriage or Private Hire vehicle, licensed anywhere in the country, can attend this venue, join a queue, which we would all recognise as a rank, and obtain work - with impunity.

The next step, presumably, is for any b*gger to turn up, no license or plate, and ply for hire.

Private land or not, I simply cannot believe this can be legal - hence we fight on! We have no option really.

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Fae Fife said:



To quote from eleswhere:



Also:

Quote:

'Plying for Hire' means being on view and inviting the public to use the vehicle

This must be the case here surely?

arent i doing that simply having a phone number and council plates on the
vehicle?...24/7

in fact, isnt that the objective?

ironically, having no identification/plate/signs would AVOID inviting anyone to approach for hiring me...it would look like a private vehicle

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Of all the things ive lost, i miss my mind the most