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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:10 pm 
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Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
All I know is that in the UK, murder is now almost common place, whereas decades ago before hanging was abolished it was almost a rarety. So from that point of view it would seem that the re-introduction of capital punishment is likely to reverse the situation we now have.

And what of the other factors since the early 60's?
Most murders these days are drug related. Would you like to string up all the junkies as well?

And the drug dealers too!!

And I'll put the noose around the neck and pull the trap door lever on that one!!!


I bet you would too.....

You just want the thrill of killing someone without having the repercussions. Does it turn you on?

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:11 pm 
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cabby john wrote:
This would have to be put into perspective by saying...............how much more worse would it be without "The Death penalty"

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:13 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
gusmac wrote:
And could you answer this:

Quote:
"What is an acceptable amount of innocent people executed?"

No answer then? :?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Evans

That is what they call collateral!!

How much collateral is acceptable?

Now you're starting to think my way, because your question is now pointing to degree of collateral.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:16 pm 
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Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
gusmac wrote:
And could you answer this:

Quote:
"What is an acceptable amount of innocent people executed?"

No answer then? :?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Evans

That is what they call collateral!!

How much collateral is acceptable?

Now your starting to think my way because your question is now pointing to degree of collateral.


My question points to your acceptance of collateral damage. Let's not hide behind PC expressions. That's innocent people murdered by the state.
Now I will ask yet again. How many innocent people is it ok to murder?

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:24 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
gusmac wrote:
And could you answer this:

Quote:
"What is an acceptable amount of innocent people executed?"

No answer then? :?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Evans

That is what they call collateral!!

How much collateral is acceptable?

Now your starting to think my way because your question is now pointing to degree of collateral.

My question points to your acceptance of collateral damage. Let's not hide behind PC expressions. That's innocent people murdered by the state.
Now I will ask yet again. How many innocent people is it ok to murder?

Murder is the unlawful killing of another human being with "malice aforethought"

What you describe is not murder, so don't get emotionally carried away.

As to your question; as many as it takes to rescue our diseased society.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:24 pm 
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Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
gusmac wrote:
And could you answer this:

Quote:
"What is an acceptable amount of innocent people executed?"

No answer then? :?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Evans

That is what they call collateral!!


I'm sure Mr Evans remaining family took comfort from the knowledge that his death was collateral damage, after already losing his wife and daughter to a serial killer that the state failed to apprehend, even when Evans pointed the finger at him.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:29 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
gusmac wrote:
And could you answer this:

Quote:
"What is an acceptable amount of innocent people executed?"

No answer then? :?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Evans

That is what they call collateral!!

I'm sure Mr Evans remaining family took comfort from the knowledge that his death was collateral damage, after already losing his wife and daughter to a serial killer that the state failed to apprehend, even when Evans pointed the finger at him.

Now you're being emotional rather than objective.

Just because Evans died erroneous, does not make the whole system of capital punishment worthless.

Less emotion, more objectiveness.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:29 pm 
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Brummie Cabbie wrote:
Murder is the unlawful killing of another human being with "malice aforethought"

What you describe is not murder, so don't get emotionally carried away.


So it's just an unfortunate error or two. That's makes it ok then.

Brummie Cabbie wrote:
As to your question; as many as it takes to rescue our diseased society.


Well let's just hope they don't start with you or yours then.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:32 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
Murder is the unlawful killing of another human being with "malice aforethought"

What you describe is not murder, so don't get emotionally carried away.

So it's just an unfortunate error or two. That's makes it ok then.

Yes it does, for the greater good of our society.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:43 pm 
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Brummie Cabbie wrote:

Just because Evans died erroneous, does not make the whole system of capital punishment worthless.


You trivialise this death because it is an uncomfortable fact that gets in the way of your sick little beliefs.
No amount of evidence would dissuade you.
Fortunately you are not in a position to put your fantasies into practise and I sincerely hope you never are.

I will leave you with the thoughts of Albert Pierrepoint

"I have come to the conclusion that executions solve nothing, and are only an antiquated relic of a primitive desire for revenge which takes the easy way and hands over the responsibility for revenge to other people...The trouble with the death penalty has always been that nobody wanted it for everybody, but everybody differed about who should get off."

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:49 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
I will leave you with the thoughts of Albert Pierrepoint

"I have come to the conclusion that executions solve nothing, and are only an antiquated relic of a primitive desire for revenge which takes the easy way and hands over the responsibility for revenge to other people...The trouble with the death penalty has always been that nobody wanted it for everybody, but everybody differed about who should get off."

That's very, very rich coming from a guy that regularly put the noose round the neck and pulled the trap-door lever!!

You couldn't make it up!!

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:54 pm 
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Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
I will leave you with the thoughts of Albert Pierrepoint

"I have come to the conclusion that executions solve nothing, and are only an antiquated relic of a primitive desire for revenge which takes the easy way and hands over the responsibility for revenge to other people...The trouble with the death penalty has always been that nobody wanted it for everybody, but everybody differed about who should get off."

That's very, very rich coming from a guy that regularly put the noose round the neck and pulled the trap-door lever!!

You couldn't make it up!!


Indeed. A man who knew far more about capital punishment than most.
Over 400 executions - Perhaps murder wasn't as uncommon as you think back then?
It must have been sad for him to conclude that his life's work had been pointless.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:56 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
Just because Evans died erroneous, does not make the whole system of capital punishment worthless.

You trivialise this death because it is an uncomfortable fact that gets in the way of your sick little beliefs.

There is nothing uncomfortable about it for me.

What about gangs of youths terrorising elderly people and killing them.

Are you comfortable with that?

Do you enjoy living in a society like that; a society that tolerates such abhorent behaviour to the point where it becomes the norm?

Because by being weak we have all encouraged the festering of our society.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:02 pm 
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Perhaps if we has sharia law here things might be different
If you nick something your hand is removed do it again your foot is removed kill someone your head is removed and placed next to your ass so you can kiss it goodbye


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:05 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
Brummie Cabbie wrote:
gusmac wrote:
I will leave you with the thoughts of Albert Pierrepoint

"I have come to the conclusion that executions solve nothing, and are only an antiquated relic of a primitive desire for revenge which takes the easy way and hands over the responsibility for revenge to other people...The trouble with the death penalty has always been that nobody wanted it for everybody, but everybody differed about who should get off."

That's very, very rich coming from a guy that regularly put the noose round the neck and pulled the trap-door lever!!

You couldn't make it up!!

Indeed. A man who knew far more about capital punishment than most.
Over 400 executions - Perhaps murder wasn't as uncommon as you think back then?
It must have been sad for him to conclude that his life's work had been pointless.

My point was that he continued to do the job for a few decades collecting his fees and only upon retirement did he make such a statement.

Indeed his view was very contradictory as later reported;

Pierrepoint's position as an abolitionist and capital punishment opponent has also been attacked by his long-time former assistant, Syd Dernley, in his 1989 autobiography The Hangman's Tale:

Even the great Pierrepoint developed some strange ideas in the end. I do not think I will ever get over the shock of reading in his autobiography, many years ago, that like the Victorian executioner James Berry before him, he had turned against capital punishment and now believed that none of the executions he had carried out had achieved anything! This from the man who proudly told me that he had done more jobs than any other executioner in English history. I just could not believe it. When you have hanged more than 680 people, it's a hell of a time to find out you do not believe capital punishment achieves anything!


So don't believe what Pierrepoint said when he was trying to justify his conscience.

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