Taxi Driver Online

The SNP are the only party in Scotland who are not influenced by big brother parties down south, The SNP are the only party who truely represent the political opinion of the majority, We have lefties, we have slightly left of centre, we have centre, we have slighty right of Centre politicians, political opinion all over the United Kingdom is compacting between slightly left and slightly right, the other parties portray they are left (Lib Dems) or they are centre (Labour) or right wing ( Tories ), i'd rather be represented by a party who have broad base of political opinion

I really should just shut up because skull and bloodnock are putting a better case for independence than me .


Iain Macwhirter Now and Then

I've been in this game too long. I remember being taken by the Tories nearly twenty years ago to Brussels to hear Baroness Ellis warn that Scotland would not be allowed to join the EU. Don't even think about it! France and Spain would block an independent Scotland to discourage their own separatist movements. England wouldn't accept Scotland as a legitimate nation. There would be years of wrangling over budgets. England would dump financial liabilities onto Scotland to reduce its contribution to the EU budget etc etc..
Scotland would end up broke and isolated, a ragged and homeless fragment lost in the North Sea. It was tedious rubbish then, and it is rubbish now. Yet, barely a week goes by without some report or other announcing that wee Scotland would be frozen out of Europe and told to go and sit on the naughty step.
I've just been looking at the latest report to hit the front pages. It came from the House of Commons Library and it is a background briefing note, not an authoritative assessment of the Scotland's legal status within the EU. It carries its own health warning "[This briefing note] should not be relied upon as legal or professional advice or as a substitute for it. A suitably qualified professional should be consulted." It goes on to rehearse all the arguments that have been made about Scotland's relationship to the EU that have been made over the years. Pros and cons - naturally, the Scotsman chose the con and headlined this as "£8bn Bill To Join The Eurozone". This presupposes that Scotland would automatically join the euro, which of course is not going to happen, at least in the short term. Just like Sweden, Scotland would have the right to decide whether and when to join the euro. The report goes on to question whether membership would be automatic and finds differing views among constitutional authorities.
Lawyers make their money from creating legal complexity, so you will always find that there are differing legal opinions about secession. But the political reality is that it is inconceivable that the EU would try to block an independent Scotland from entry. The EU is founded on the principle of national self-determination, so the idea that Scotland would not be recognised as a nation in Europe is ludicrous. Scotland is already a part of the EU through its participation in the United Kingdom, and as a nation in its own right, Scotland would automatically qualify for membership of the EU. It would take concerted action by the other member states to prove, either that Scotland is financially insolvent, or that it is not a democracy, or that it is in in violation of the European convention on human rights. That is not going to happen.
Sure, there may be bureaucratic obstacles to formal entry - calculations of Scotland's contribution, relationship to the eurozone, Shenghen - all of which are the subject of opt outs by the UK. But many of these problems would also face the RUK (Residual United Kingdom) in exactly the same way. How much should England and Wales pay exempt of Scotland? What weight should English votes continue to carry in the Council etc etc..
But the central question: Scotland's ability to remain in the EU, answers itself. in 2004, the EU admitted a raft of small European countries many of which had been part of the Soviet empire. The idea that the EU would reject Scotland because it used to be part of the UK is laughable. Iceland is being given a free entry ticket to the EU as I write. Scotland is a wealthy country, unlike Greece or the small former Eastern block countries like Latvia and Estonia or minnows like Malta. Scotland has around £400 billion in oil reserves, a quarter of Europe's wind and wave energy, five of the top universities in the planet.
I despair at unionists who make these arguments because they are only destroying their own case. If this is the standard of debate we can expect in the run up to the independence referendum then - roll on independence!

Take my advice you Eckites everywhere, Enjoy the SNP now because this is as good as its ever going to get for you. Independance will never happen in our lifetimes, and once the SNP's little ruse of trying to buy off the Voters through its debt inducing Shangri-La strategy is seen for the Scam it is, the people will ditch you quicker than a Hot Knife cuts through Haggis.

I'll not try and make you SNP types to see the futility of your aims, you will just have to discover for yourselves that you have all been hoodwinked by the party you all worship.

And Im sure you'll be pleased to hear that Im not taking any further part in this futile argument...your wrong and I accept that.

Here's a presumption for you's to stew over

I believe that Great Britain as the English have been educated to believe exist's, is now too big for westminster, we have a devolved parliament as N.Ireland and Wales do too, in Europe though we are still only 1 voice, Westminster lead us to believe they have influence in Europe but we don't really do we, ask any German and they will tell you we have more in common with America than we do with Europeans, boy David though is in denial though and the Tories want more power within Europe thats why some of their MEPs have joined a right wing faction that is growing within the halls of the Euro Parliament, i believe the Tories like the SNP want Scotland to become independant so as to increase the 1 voice to 2 voices, yes we will have 4 voices but really only 2 with an influence, remember Scotland has ALL the resources, a future big player within europe, boy David can shout about changing the human rights act to a bill of rights but that is not just about the UK, European wide i tell you and its to stop the high level of asylum seeking etc, the problem boy David has is Alex Salmond, Alex isn't playing the game David wants him to play, if within an independant, Scotland do automatically become a member of the Euro parliament Boy David knows he will have a hard task getting Alex on side but its not impossible that in the future Scotland and England can work together but only on Equal terms, not like the last 304 years



P.S We all feed of Capitalism so long live Capitalism

What the fu*k has any of the above to do with anything? It's the system, get it? Democracy is a fine ideal, in principle, but that's not we have. It has been usurped by the money men and an unaccountable political class with vested interests. Politicians don't represent the public any more than Brian Souter gives a [edited by admin] about the people of Scotland.

What don't you understand about a lack of accountability and transparency? Is Iain MacWhirter going to give us the transparency we need to make our politicians directly accountable? I don't think so somehow.

The “democracy” we live in isn't going to change because it's not in the interests of those who own and run the country.

All Iain McWhirter is trying to justify is swapping one system of political hegemony for another. It's still the same neighbourhood but with a different gang running things.

Stationtone, you are truly delusional, and what's more. You think if you repeat their argument for independence this makes you a part of their gang. Get a grip, ffs.

I take it you did not like Iain Mcwhirters article , yes I suppose it might be upsetting for someone who has believed what Westminster has said all these years that Scotland is to wee and would end up broke and isolated .So when you add your paranoia of that the whole political system and world is out to shaft me the feeling must be real sore .
You are right on one thing though we will be swapping one political system for another to one that allows the Scottish people to decide how they spend their oil and gas revenues ,does not send their soldiers into illegal wars and will not privatise the NHS .
You also got the earlier questions wrong the answers were water,oil and gas.

You still don't get it do you? It doesn't matter who is in control the “democratic” system is not set up to deliver transparency and accountability to the people, and without it, your politicians represent their own interests and that of big business. You and I, simply do not count. I'm not making this up, and it isn't paranoia. It's a statement of fact.

If you could show me how the system under independence would become transparent with politicians being made directly accountable to their electorate, I would vote for it tomorrow.

Think about it, no more deals being done behind closed doors with lobbyists of big companies influencing policy and no more little favours or jobs for those supposed to be representing your interests. And if anyone gets caught their pension is gone along with their liberty. "Government of the people, by the people , for the people."


Is this what the SNP, are bringing to Scotland?

You are right on one thing though we will be swapping one political system for another to one that allows the Scottish people to decide how they spend their oil and gas revenues

The McCrone report

The McCrone report was a dossier written in 1974 by Professor Gavin McCrone, a leading government economist, for the Conservative UK government into the viability of an independent Scotland. The report concluded that North sea oil revenue would have given an independent Scotland one of the strongest currencies in Europe and a large tax surplus. It went on to say that officials advised government ministers on how to take "the wind out of the SNP sails". The incoming Labour administration classified the document as secret over fears it could give a further boost to the SNP's policy of Scottish independence. The dossier came to light in 2005 when the SNP obtained the report under the Freedom of Information Act 2000. The full provisions of the Act came into force on 1st January 2005 .


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4238744.stm

http://www.oilofscotland.org/mccronereport.pdf

What political system do you suggest and would Scotland be independent in it .
The reason i vote SNP is because i believe they are more transparent and accountable to the Scottish electorate than any of the Westminster parties will ever be .
I agree the current democratic system is not working hence the reason i think Independence would be better , lets face it can we really be any worse of than we already are under westminster .

I want you to break free, for many reason's, one I won't have to sub you anymore, two you should be an indy nation, and three none of the mad rules that apply here now will apply to you giving you the chance to make sensible laws for yourselves, but remember the Bruce double crossed you, so whats to say these present day "leaders" won't sell you out again as well.

But the article by Iain Macwhirter that you quoted said the EU wanted Scotland because of its energy resources, which is presumably because they want a share of the spoils.

If Scotland is as wealthy as is claimed then it'd just be like a mini Germany, bailiing out the likes of the Greeks. But it's the resentment being increasingly generated by the likes of this that means the EU could well fall apart, so basically Scotland would be swapping the 'broken' UK for a similar situation on a larger scale in the form of the EU.

Indeed, in view of all Salmond's spending comittments - while at the same time promising lower corporation tax, fuel duty etc - Scotland could well end up another Greece or Ireland anyway.