Taxi Driver Online

Hi Guys, I’m a ‘newbie’ to this forum who’s looking to get some information from experienced people within the taxi industry.

We’re looking at setting up a website where customers enter the journey they wish to take and local private hire taxi firms are able to quote a fixed fee for that journey. If the customer finds the price acceptable, then they book the job online.

Just a few questions which hopefully you guys can help with:
1) Will private hire firms be comfortable providing (and sticking to) a fixed rate for local journeys?
2) Who is responsible for setting the price of a journey? Is it typically the operator, or the driver?
3) How does the payment to taxi drivers work? Are the majority of drivers on payroll or self employed?
4) Are there any common systems taxi operators use to book jobs in? If so, can people give me the details so I can check them out?

Thanks guys, looking forward to receiving some (much needed!) info.

Regards,

Paul

Paul before you go any further mate "STOP". The above market is flooded out with websites like you mention above. I've lost count of how many people come on here offering services of a web based booking system for Taxis and PH.

Many Taxi and PH companies have their own websites which can be set up for pennies, these will include a fare table and a booking application along with a phone number, they will also have a credit card payment facility.

Your not going to like this bit but here goes, many Taxi and PH companies have been scammed by web based booking companies and are now giving them the get lost reply. In this trade once you've been bitten you don't go back there again.

Hi Nidge, thanks for the reply.

Appreciate the info regarding the existing sites from your experience - we've done a lot of research and seen a number of 'dubious' looking sites out there (which is a shame if its tainted the concept to taxi and PH companies).

From what we've seen these are mainly airport booking sites and are only associated with one taxi/PH firm.

We'd like to believe our concept will be unique, and hopefully not fall into the same bracket as the existing offerings.



Thanks for the point about a number of taxi and PH companies being scammed in the past - we were unaware of this and like you say it could cause a real issue when trying to get the taxi and PH companies interested... Great to know - so thanks for sharing your opinion!

I'd love to get more thoughts and feedback (especially around the 4 points i mentioned) - so if anyone else out there has anything they'd like to add, that'd be great!

Cheers guys,


Paul


P.S. i'm definitely NOT looking to sell or peddle anything here. I'm just purely looking for thoughts and feedback from you guys who have experience in this industry.

Cheers for the first reply Nidge!

Sorry Paul I got carried away and didn't reply to your questions you wanted

1. Many Private hire companies work on fixed rates, if the customer requests another drop off then there'll be an extra charge, in a Hackney the price will be on the meter.

2. Prices for Hackney Carriages are set by the local Councils all vehicles will have a fare table in their vehicle, some Private Hire Companies run at the same fare as Hackney Carriages, them who don't are fools.

3. Nearly all Taxi and PH Drivers are Self Employed, some work on a 60 / 40 split but are still Self Employed.

4. There's a plethora of booking systems on the market all with credit card facilities. Look at the links page on the left hand side for booking and dispatch systems.

Cheers Nidge!

The info & feedback is much appreciated!

In terms of PH, is it the operator who is responsible for setting the fixed fee on a job?

Paul

The owner of the company Paul, like I mentioned above most will follow the Councils fare table but other operators like to undercut each other and run at a loss.

Presumably your inconsistent terminology means you're looking at both Hackney Carriages and Private Hire?

I don't see why not, because it's likely that both sides would want to engage with such a service, assuming it was viable, but that's another question entirely.

But have a read here at this recent discussion about terminology:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=18752



Probably not if they use meters, whether or not they're set at HC rates. But more so on longer trips.

The problem with local journeys is that's there's just too many variables. For example, imprecision as to the pick up and destination, taking detours that weren't agreed beforehand (to pick up others, for example) or waiting time that wasn't annonced beforehand (eg going into a shop during the trip).

Thus if it's a run that takes a couple of hours then a two minute detour to pick up someone else or stopping for fags or a detour to a cash point isn't a big deal, but if it's a half-mile journey then it can become a big deal and cause friction.

Thus for a local journey to give qoutes the precise circumstances of the journey would have to be a agreed beforehand, but this is probably impractical, and the more local the journey is the more likely this is to apply.

I've done half-mile quoted local trips agreed by an office where. for example, when you arrive they expect you to go up two flights of stairs several times to get their personal possessions, put the car's seats down etc then do the same at the other end - ie effectively a small removal job - so a two-minute trip turns into twenty minutes.

Personally I wouldn't touch very local quoted journeys with a barge pole, but I daresay some PH firms would, particularly if they don't use meters.



Again unless there's meters involved it's generally the operator, although the driver could agree directly with the passenger if there's any change of route or whatever. If the vehicles are HCs then the driver may have some discretion as regards negotiating street hires, but again this varies depending on the precise arrangements.

But both sides are often not very good at communicating such matters with each other - or indeed may choose not to communicate such matters in certain circumstances - which may lead to friction between the operator and/or driver and/or passenger(s).



Very few are on PAYE if that's what you mean, but apart from that there are various arrangements, ie fixed wage, fixed wage plus part commission, split bags at various percentages before fuel, split bags at various percentages after fuel, fixed rental for vehicle, variable rental for vehicle - that probably covers the most common arrangments. The driver generally keeps any tips, but some owners even want a share of them.

But that's just for the drivers who don't own the vehicle. There's a good chance the driver will also own the vehicle, and he will normally pay a fixed fee to an office to provide him with work - unless of course he has a stake in the business taking the bookings - and will of course pay the other car running expenses, and what's left is his profit.



The only one I know much about is phone, pen and paper

What Nidge means is that there's a lot of competition in some areas, but I don't think operators like undercutting each other and they certainly don't like running at a loss.

And in some areas you won't get any PH operators following the council tariff, although in others HC and PH pricing is effectively identical.

There are hundreds of local markets, and no two are the same.

But Nidge is certainly correct in that a lot of people in the trade don't like the kind of thing you're proposing, especially since many have had their fingers burnt in such areas.

Hi Dusty, thanks for the comprehensive reply!

Some fantastic ‘inside’ info there (stuff we’d never have known without chatting to people within the industry) – so thanks very much to you and Nidge.


Can I give you more insight into the way the site is to work? This way you guys (or others viewing) can advise on any further thoughts or potential issues… (I’m sure there will be some!)

The website is due to work like this for Private Hire:
1. The customer logs onto the website and enters where they wish to be picked up (postcode or notable location) and where they wish to be taken to (again, postcode or notable location) along with exactly when they would like the collection (i.e. ASAP or a set-time in the future)
2. The ‘job’ (detailing the collection & destination location, along with the mileage involved) is sent to the PH operators who cover the areas the collection and/or delivery locations are (so potentially multiple firms)
3. The PH operators can then quote a fixed price for the job, along with an estimated wait time (if collection is required ASAP)
4. The customer can review the quotes they receive, and choose a firm based on the price quoted and the estimated wait time
5. The customer books the job via the site and the PH operator who has been awarded the job is advised of this.


One big Question we have based on this process:
- What's the best (in your view) method for the PH operators to receive (and respond!) to these jobs coming in?
i.e. do most PH operators have a PC with internet access in the office? If not, could text message work? Email via mobile phone perhaps?? Carrier pigeon??? (joke! )

Can you guys (and anyone else viewing) see any major flaws with the process above?

Cheers,

Paul

One flaw I can see is if the customer wants to be picked up ASAP. By the time the enquiry has been received by you and sent out to operators and the operator has replied to you and you have replied to the customer..............The customer will have rang his usual provider and already be on his way.

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Grandad,

Those systems are based on price, and although that's important, it's not the sole reason folks book cabs.

Availability is a major issue, cos firm A might be 10% cheaper but if they have no cars in the area at the time, it's irrelevant.

I get asked only a few times a day how much the fare will be, so I'm not convinced the taxi-supermarket.com business model will work.

Maybe on the airport or longer runs, but that market is flooded with websites, and I'm not convinced any of them make serious money.

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IDFIMH

Apart from the points already made, the whole thing just sounds too cumbersome for local runs.

And I just cant see offices being willing to bid against each others in this way for local jobs, or even longer ones for that matter.

Especially in areas where they're operating price-fixing cartels.

How dare you sugest such a thing!

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Grandad,

And of course we need to remind these websites of the 1976 act.

Are those sites 'in the course of business making provision for the invitation or acceptance of bookings for a private hire vehicle' ?

If so then they need an operator's license.

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IDFIMH