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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:34 pm 
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Judge To Decide Whether Uber Can Operate In London

As Uber seeks to reinstate its license to provide ride-hailing services in London after a suspension, the city’s transportation regulator will leave the decision up to a judge.

Bloomberg News reported that Transport for London (TfL) will stay neutral and let the court decide whether Uber can operate in its biggest European market.

Citing that Uber was unfit to hold a license, TfL suspended the company’s operations last November. Uber first lost its license in 2017, but was granted two extensions as the company improved its service.

In a filing for a court hearing on Friday (Aug. 28), an attorney for Uber said that TfL has signaled it will leave the final decision on renewal to a judge.

“The question whether, in the light of the changes made by Uber London since the decision, it is now a fit and proper person, is one for the court,” Tim Ward, Uber's lawyer, said in the filing, noting that it was a summary of the regulator’s view.

Since Uber’s first suspension three years ago, Lyft, its chief competitor, has talked with TfL and City Hall officials to bring its service to London. Lyft still does not offer ride-hailing in the city.

Uber’s request to resume driving on London’s streets comes one month after a group of Uber drivers in England filed suit against the company for its alleged failure to provide access to data and an explanation of algorithmic management.

The App Drivers and Couriers Union (ADCU), a U.K.-based group, filed a lawsuit against Uber in the District Court of Amsterdam, where Uber’s European headquarters is located. The 10-page complaint said that by not providing the information, Uber is in violation of the European Union’s General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR), which regulates privacy protection in the 28-nation bloc.

Drivers from London, Birmingham, Nottingham and Glasgow are demanding the right for their data to be sent directly to their union for purposes of collective bargaining. They are asking the court to order Uber to comply with the data protection law or be fined 10,000 euros ($11,443) for each day it continues to violate the law.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 12:47 am 
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Is it not normal practice in an appeal case that a judge or judges have the final say.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 6:45 pm 
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heathcote wrote:
Is it not normal practice in an appeal case that a judge or judges have the final say.

You make a good point, but I think the point Uber (or the article) is trying to emphasise is that in their view TfL couldn't care less which way this went.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 6:46 pm 
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Taxi-Point website has some more info about the pre trial hearing.

https://www.taxi-point.co.uk/post/uber- ... nce-appeal

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 7:14 pm 
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Uber 'covered up safety flaw that let its drivers swap photo IDs'

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/0 ... photo-ids/

Uber attempted to cover up a major safety flaw that allowed drivers to use fake identities, a court has heard.

The ride-hailing app was accused of not notifying Transport for London of a glitch that let drivers swap their photos in the app, potentially letting drivers use profiles that were not theirs, in the run-up to the authority's decision not to renew Uber's licence to operate in London.

Uber's licence was refused last November by TfL, which cited "several breaches that placed passengers and their safety at risk". The cab app is appealing the decision and continues to operate in the capital under an extension while proceedings are ongoing.

Yesterday, at a hearing at Westminster Magistrates' Court to prepare for the final appeal hearing next month, it was heard that Uber received 27,799 safety-related complaints in the first six months of 2019 alone.

The company was also accused of ­allowing the glitch that let drivers use bogus identities and shared accounts, while not flagging the issue to TfL.

In February, the black cab drivers' group the Licensed Taxi Drivers' Association (LTDA) was granted permission to take part in the appeal.

At the hearing yesterday, Gerald Gouriet, for the LTDA, said: "Uber ­attempted to conceal the photo fraud issue. When that became unrealistic, they covered it up. It's the concealment - that is the issue."

However, Tim Ward, representing Uber, said the claim the company "attempted to conceal or minimise matters" was "completely undefined". He said that Uber was "to put it mildly, strongly concerned about these proceedings" and argued the issue of the fake driver identities had been raised too late to be considered by the judge.

He added: "The issues are complex and wide-ranging as it is. I have no doubt legal teams on both sides are ­entirely flat-out trying to get this case ready for court. It is highly prejudicial for wide-ranging allegations to be made at this late stage. They have had this ­decision since February and Uber's ­evidence since July."

The judge, deputy chief magistrate Tan Ikram, said he wanted the issue ­resolved before the appeal went ahead.

After a 25-minute break in which lawyers thrashed out details, the judge was informed both sides had reached a consensus that it would be considered whether Uber concealed the photo fraud issue from TfL. The court also heard that at the final appeal hearing Uber will have a whole day to open its case, while TfL's opening will take only 45 minutes, plus 30 minutes for submissions from the LTDA.

Speaking about the length of Uber's opening submission, Mr Ward said: "The material is dense and lengthy and the issues are complex."

He asked the judge if he was familiar with the Uber app, or whether he needed a "walkthrough". Mr Ikram responded, chuckling: "It would be helpful. That's not to say I haven't got it somewhere on my phone but, yes."

The final appeal is due to be heard on Sept 14.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 7:17 pm 
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the trouble is Uber have made sure this is a long dragged out court case thereby wearing TFL down.

I am not surprised they want to see the back of this. I suspect they rue the day they tried to take uber on.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 7:37 pm 
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edders23 wrote:
the trouble is Uber have made sure this is a long dragged out court case thereby wearing TFL down.

I am not surprised they want to see the back of this. I suspect they rue the day they tried to take uber on.

I think the problem is the law.

Was Uber fit and proper when TfL refused to re-license? Most probably not.

But that's not the issue, the issue is is Uber fit and proper now? IMO they aren't, but I'm not the Deputy Chief Magistrate.

So the law could be viewed as an ass as it doesn't seem to take into account past mistakes for operators as long as those mistakes are not repeated.

Unlike the likes of you and me who wouldn't get a second chance as a licensed driver if we breached our regulations in the same way Uber breached theirs.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:45 am 
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If they win , it will almost be the end of the black cab trade, many of London's finest have already called it a day, the number have gone down already


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 7:01 pm 
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skippy41 wrote:
If they win , it will almost be the end of the black cab trade, many of London's finest have already called it a day, the number have gone down already

I'm 100% certain the London black cab trade will out live Uber.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 4:15 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
skippy41 wrote:
If they win , it will almost be the end of the black cab trade, many of London's finest have already called it a day, the number have gone down already

I'm 100% certain the London black cab trade will out live Uber.



I think a few of the PH companies might not but it looks as though by hook or by crook Uber are winning their battles. They also seem to be doing better than most so I suspect they will soon reach the critical mass of outnumbering all the rest of the trade put together in their chosen markets !

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