Taxi Driver Online

I didn't ignore anything of the kind because I never responded to that post. My response was to your very first post in this thread, which still hasn't been answered?

I would say that in the case of Gateshead it has been clearly identified that the quality of services offered "since the removal of quantity controls" has been reduced to such levels, which are considered to be of detriment to the taxi user.

I can see you're going to evade the question indefinitely so there is no point in proceeding but I will say this. From your position on quantity controls it is my belief that it is not the customer who has suffered but those drivers who enjoyed the privilege of quantity restrictions before Gateshead changed its policy. Those drivers and owners entering the Gateshead Taxi trade after restrictions were lifted do not have a right to complain because they were issued their plates without having to pay a premium. They have no right to try and stop others entering the trade in the same way.

I do not know what you "call quality of Service" because so far you have completely ignored my request for an example?

I believe most members of the public would define a taxi service as being prompt and readily available. In the case of Gateshead you have demonstrated on more than one occasion in the past that at weekends the Town is cleared by 3 am and there are Taxis available to the public at all times. Indeed, we had Frankie stating it was because of the new competition under derestriction that he nearly went bankrupt.

Gateshead has over 300 cabs so the service to the public in respect of availability has improved since the increase from 87 and that is confirmed by your own past comments.

I understand Deans taxis hold a large number of those three hundred or so plates and has been suggested on here that it could be as high as one hundred? How Mister Dean conducts his business is no concern of mine but it would seem he may be responsible for at least a third of your troubles, If indeed you really believe as you say you do, "that the quality of service has declined" since deregulation?

The reality of the situation is this, Quality of Service has nothing whatsoever to do with any council, any trade union, any Government body or any individual. The reason being is because every hackney carriage driver is self-employed and the bodies I mentioned have no jurisdiction on how licensed Taxi drivers conduct their business or when they conduct their business.

You use derestriction as an excuse to support your unfounded argument that quality of service has reduced. You do so without defining what you actually mean by quality of service? Furthermore you bandy quality of service around as though you or someone else can control how it is delivered?

Quality of Service is as each INDIVIDUAL perceives it to be and no amount of rhetoric from you or anyone else will ever change that perception. I'm sure you realise that but there are many local authorities who think that because they issue licenses they have a right to dictate how drivers conduct their business.

In a nutshell I don't think its the quality of service that perturbs you but the fact that the word "derestriction" has been substituted for the word "restriction". Reverse the process and no doubt all your problems will be solved and you will be telling us that quality of service has once again returned to Gateshead.

In my opinion that is the basic thrust of your argument and whatsmore where derestriction in Gateshead is concerned it always has been and probably always will be.

JD

The situation currently in Gateshead is under review, exactly what the outcome will be no-one is sure .......................... but tighter controls are the goal and if the council are going to properly manage then they will, in my opinion need to control every aspect.

You however seem to believe that any Tom, Dick or Harry should be able to enter the trade and destroy your reputation by operating without any of the principles you operate within.

The fact of the matter remains that the trade has a very poor public perception and we must look to change this or risk not being able to do for a living what we want and are capable of.

For answers to your questions read my other posts, what we need is the right number of the right people driving the right number of taxis.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

Deans do indeed have a large number of HC working their PH circuit, I don't think it is 100 though. I believe (and this is only an estimate) that Deans only have about 25 HC vehicles themselves the rest are owner drivers.

Gateshead Central also have a large number of HC vehicles working their PH circuit, again mostly owner drivers.

The question's really are "how many of these HC vehicles ONLY work the office and never touch the ranks", therefore would they not be better licensing PH ...................... or could their be an increased rental incentive for such PH operators.
And, obviously, why do they need to pay to work from an office if there is so much unmet demand for taxi services in Gateshead.

The fact remains that when commenting on unmet demand people not connected to the trade directly, and we can include the government in this, include telephone booking availability within their unmet demand calculation .............. that sector of the trade is served by the PH sector and as far as I'm aware that sector has never had its numbers controlled.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

I wonder why there has been no response.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

I didn't realise that telephone bookings were included in a SUD analysis?

But if it is then surely increasing PH shows an unmet demand for HCs with regard to telephone bookings?

_________________
Taxi Driver Online
www.taxi-driver.co.uk

Because telephone bookings are mentioned within the government guidelines this thread is discussing and also in the OFT report.
Both report on taxi services .................. and both (wrongly) include PH within that service.

PH operations generally contain the word TAXIS within their trading name, so its fair to assume that the public and uninitiated would consider that company to be a taxi provider, rather than what it actually is.

The PH industry seems to think that they should not be included in any survey results where telephone bookings are quoted as showing an unmet demand. Or are you suggesting that the survey findings are only taken by telephone bookings made to HC ONLY operations.

It is fair to assume that in reality telephone bookings are made to PH operators who have the word Taxi within their trading name AND IT HAS BEEN ASSUMED that they are TAXI operators.

This is wrong and if anyone believes in the truth would want to show that with regard telephone bookings the unlimited PH sector must take the proportion of responsibility for the unmet demand regarding telephone bookings.




But if it is then surely increasing PH shows an unmet demand for HCs with regard to telephone bookings

But a HC responsibilities are to be available for an immediate hiring from a rank or to be hailed in the street, NOT to be contactable by a telephone or any other method.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

Here,Here!!!!!!!!

_________________
pussycat

But the point is that the SUD test doesn't take account of telephone work that would be done by taxis if numbers weren't restricted. This is demonstrated by PH growth in areas where numbers aren't restricted.

The flaw that in the methodology is that HCs do undertake phone work and PH do increase in numbers to do work that HCs can't do, thus rather than allowing HCs to grow in line with demand the SUD test fails to address this growth and as a result distorts the supply side of the market.




Your point being?




What I'm saying is that the narrow focus of the SUD test doesn't take account of all the workings of the market, as outlined above.

As for the PH industry, well they would say that, wouldn't they?




But the point is about the efficacy of stifling HC supply, and my point is that your point demonstrates that demand for HC merely ends up elsewhere if supply is suppressed.

Your point about the blurring of HC/PH demonstrates that the public aren't really bothered what side services them, thus underlining that the simplistic dichotomy of the SUD test is invalid.




You mean that's what you'd like to happen, but unfortunately for you the real world is a bit different. In my manor, for example, I suspect taxis do a lot more pre-booked work that street work - indeed, for the busy offices I suspect 80%+ of their work is pre-booked.

I've often thought there could be some merit in confining HCs to street work only, but that would require fundamental change and new legislation.

But it was you who doesn't want that and thinks a bit of tinkering with the current regime would be adequate.

_________________
Taxi Driver Online
www.taxi-driver.co.uk

That's exactly my point though TDO.

The responsibility of the HC is to service rank and street work ............ something you claim is suffering through lack of available vehicles.

If the amount of street work shows a significant unmet demand why are so many of the HC in your area PAYING a private hire operator for work OR putting out their own telephone numbers and taking bookings.

Your argument makes no sense other than to show that a sector which is not controlled by numbers cannot cope with the demands placed upon it by their users, which leaves a gap for HC drivers, who do not have enough work from the ranks or streets, to pay a PH operator a significant amount of money every week for work.

So TDO, the fact remains unanswered .................... if there is an abundance of work for HC on the ranks or streets WHY do most of the HC in your area either take bookings themselves or PAY a PH operator.


B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

You mean that's what you'd like to happen, but unfortunately for you the real world is a bit different. In my manor, for example, I suspect taxis do a lot more pre-booked work that street work - indeed, for the busy offices I suspect 80%+ of their work is pre-booked.


In your manner the hackney trade has turned into private hire because there is no demand for Hackney's

_________________
Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!

Bullocks



No, you say it's their responsibility - the law and the real world say that an HC can service both the streets and pre-booked work. That's a fact, whatever you may desire.

My point has always been that if more vehicles are dual purpose then both markets benefit, although if a driver ultimately wants to serve only one market or the other than who am I to deny him? You and others may want to play God, but not me




Two points:

1 - There's no SUD in my area, nor have I ever claimed there was, so where do you get that from?

2 - No one in my area is paying a PH operator because there aren't any - they are HC despatch offices.

But as regards your substantive point, many HCs do despatch work irrespective of whether there's SUD or not - it's merely about maximising profit - the thinking is obviously that if they do phone work as well then they'll make more - it's not really to do with SUD.





What, you mean that the uncontrolled PH sector can't control with demand? Well that's hardly surprising in my manor because their aren't any PH, thus it's hardly surprsing that they can't cope with demand.

But if you're alluding to your own manor then if PH is so busy then why are HCs sitting about doing naff all? I would imagine it's about personal choice - my view is that you can take a horse to water, but you can't make it drink - it's all about not playing god again.

I could make more with a despatch office, but I prefer working the ranks, as do many other drivers in the country - any chance you could just leave us to get on with it?





Who said there's an abundance of work?

_________________
Taxi Driver Online
www.taxi-driver.co.uk

Certainly TDO ................... but is there any chance of me being able to afford to have the same choice.

You see your arguments take away the choice of HC drivers and make working for a PH operator a necessity.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

Firstly the SUD in my area is for PH.

Secondly are all the HC despatch offices co-operatives or are they privately owned, and do they have a weekly radio rental of over £100 a week.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

You don't accept then that by your statement it is actually you that is playing god, as you are determining what a person should be doing during their time at work.

We have 330 HC as you well know, and nearly 700 PH. So to state that the position in your area is at all comparable to mine is absolutely outrageous.

Current HC drivers cannot afford to take the risk of paying approx £400 more a month to work a PH circuit when it is clearly apparent that WHEN THE RANKS ARE BUSY SO ARE THE OFFICES AND WHEN THE RANKS ARE QUIET SO ARE THE OFFICES.

The situation in your area is quite obviously different ............. and that is why local authorities need to retain control over local licensing issues, because, as I have stated for many years WHATS GOOD FOR YOUR AREA ISN'T ALWAYS GOOD FOR SOMEWHERE ELSE.

So please stop trying to preach that it is.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

On the contrary, I would say that our manors are very similar, the only reason they look different is because of the different regulatory courses taken by our respective councils.

As I said the other week, there seems to be very few PH in Carlise, yet is the market really inherently different from Gateshead?

Why are there so few PH in Carlisle?

And are you trying to say that there are no HCs in Gateshead doing pre-booked work?

As for playing God, it's me that's advocating driver choice, it's you that's trying to choose for them

_________________
Taxi Driver Online
www.taxi-driver.co.uk