Taxi Driver Online

The standards of entry are the same for everyone in each individual authority. What you mean is that the entry standard for obtaining a license in the provinces varies from area to area but none are as high as the standards required by London.

London standards are high because the degree of difficulty is based on the size of the area and the massive amount of structures and roads contained in that area. Therefore the larger the density of the area the higher degree of difficulty?

Under normal circumstances without studying it I doubt very few people could go from one area to another and pass a knowledge test without having worked there? Except perhaps these Eastern Europeans?

The point your missing is the fact that this debate is not about knowledge tests but about the legality of hackney carriages in one area working as private hire in another? And quite frankly we have been through this scenario time and time again. I pointed out several weeks ago the failings of the licensing system in this respect and until the licensing system is changed then we are all stuck with the interpretation of the law.

Newcastle have one simple solution if they think these operators are breaking the law, then take them to court?

Regards

JD

The issue is not about standards.

If I can concentrate your mind a little, the issue is whether or not it is legal for a person to take a private hire booking from anywhere in the country for a hackney carriage driver and his vehicle licensed in another part of the country? That is the only question that arises in this instance.

The issue of competence is an entirely different matter altogether but once you have addressed the question of legality, perhaps you can then move on to the issue of competence but it is pointless putting the cart before the horse.

Answer me this...........

Do you agree that a hackney carriage can be booked for a journey that does not commence, end or pass through the district in which the vehicle and driver are licensed and that such a booking can be arranged by a person who does not require any form of licence.

If you do agree then the issue of knowledge tests is dead in the water and you should concentrate your energy on asking the Government for new legislation. Its as simple as that.

Regards

JD

GA

In answer to your question about Hacks working allover the place legally.

Whta appears to happen is the PH operator in the 'big' town establishes an 'office' in the neighbouring 'rural' district.

They then 'place work' with the Hacks licensed in the rural district through via 'the office' in the rural district.

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A member of the Hire or Reward Industry

Ok, A Hackney Carriage Vehicle Licence is a licence to operate a Hackney Carriage and accept hirings either from the street, ranks or via their telephone.

If a Hackney Carriage owner then wishes to pass that work on he can only pass it on to another Hackney Carriage ............. he cannot pass the work onto a PH driver as he does not have a licence to operate PH vehicles.

Work from the streets or ranks obviously begins within their own licensing district, booked work is taken at the customers request.

I don't think that someone who is not licensed can arrange (or be responsible for the arranging) of a hiring of any licensed vehicle.


B. Lucky

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"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

I think I did state that I have read the relevent judgements which question the Law.

Because I think the Law states that a Hackney Carriage is only a Hackney Carriage within its prescribed distance ................. once it leaves that prescribed distance to work continually it becomes unlicensed and therefore unable to undertake work under a PH contract in another area.

B. Lucky

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"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

What exactly is a private hire booking?

Is it a booking made with a Private Hire operator?

Who is the booking made with .................. if it is made with a person licensed to take bookings and the undertaking of that booking is completed within the law then I have no question.

For example - Taxicall (or similar). A person calls a central number .......... that call is then transferred to the person registered in the area the call was made from, that person would be licensed to operate in that area.

What I'm saying here is that the companies you are going to hold up as examples are not taking bookings for Hackney Carriages ............. they are offering the facility for a booking to be made with a Hackney Carriage operator who can legally take that booking.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

Is it not JD ............ because a PH operator in Gateshead has suggested that it is, and has threatened to circumvent higher quality standards if they are, in his opinion, to high.

Did you get that ..................... in his opinion?

If we introduce quality controls with regard vehicles or drivers which he believes are to high he will seek an authority where the quality standards are lower and send drivers there to get their licenses and then use the HC vehicles from that area to undertake PH work in Gateshead permanantly.

So Quality controls such as increasing the number of vehicle tests, age restrictions, vehicle type restrictions or indeed any of the things you have suggested should be introduced, could be circumvented by licensing in a different district.

So I will ask you a question.

Are we wasting out time introducing quality controls in Gateshead ?

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

What are your quality controls then JD ?

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

Is that a "Yes" you agree, or a "No" you disagree?

Regards

JD

It would have to be a NO I disagree, by virtue of the fact that a person needs to be licensed to accept a booking, then the person who conducts the hiring needs to be licensed as well as the vehicle they are to conduct the hiring within the same licensing district.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

The issue of this thread in respect of Newcastle is not about standards but the law? The sooner you realise that the better. Furthemore if Newcastle think these operators are breaking the law, then they have a ready made solution through the courts?

As I have stated in the past we have been here many times before and instead of licensing officers complaining about cross border hiring they want to get their finger out of their backside and prosecute the culprits, if indeed they think they have a case? I might add that if councillors didn't have control of licensing we wouldn't have this crazy cycle of litigation on every issue?

Regards

JD

Well I thank you for giving a straight answer but in that case who is breaking the law in Newcastle? Is it just the person taking the bookings in Newcastle for the hackney carriage driver's of Berwick, or solely the hackney carriage drivers of Berwick, or both?

Regards

JD

It has to be both JD.

The hypothetical Berwick driver is licensed as a Hackney in Berwick ............ when the vehicle leaves Berwick it ceases to be a Hackney Carriage and as it cannot be anything else it cannot be used as a PH vehicle in Newcastle.

The hypotherical Newcastle private hire operator is obligated under Section 46 to only use licensed vehicles to conduct hirings, and as the Berwick driver is only Licensed as a HC within Berwick he is unlicensed in Newcastle.

I would accept the fact that as a HC licensed in Gateshead I would be allowed to accept a hiring from Berwick to Newcastle even including the return journey however I do not think that I am entitled to work as in wait or stand in either Berwick or Newcastle in between hirings. Does it not state within the 1847 Act that a Hackney Carriage should procede to the closest available rank after each hiring.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

We have JD ........... many times.

I would obviously be more interested in change if I knew what you thought we could change to.

I fear that we would stop entrusting people who have no or limited knowledge and place control of our industry into the hands who have limited or no knowledge and no experience in our industry.

We are now working with our council ............ but we must accept their shorcomings and they must accept ours.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

A hackney carriage is always a hackney carriage, no matter where it is.

It can only pick up from the streets within it's area un-booked, but it is never a PH.

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IDFIMH